[Patrick Turner]

Maybe 50,000 readers of rec.audio.tubes believe democracy is an evil
repugnant device by which weak folks get to survive along with the
strong who seem to be addicted to war, lies, and never sharing
anything with anyone and who have a general policy of **** YOU TOO.
All these selfish ppl have no sense of humour, think the C word is
"compassion" and that all weak ppl should die, unless its their dad,
or their brother.

But here in Oz there is a new wave of gas wells with chemical
pollution in water supplied despite government regs and industry
assurances. Farmers and land holders have found alliances with the
Greens to pressurize Govt to do something to save farms water land etc
during this invasion. The Invaders only had to put in a few gas wells
and guess what? very abnormal chemicals begin appearing in water.
Despite all that Flipper says about being well reasoned and doing
research, on the ground and out there with ppl affected by gas wells,
life has become HELL. Flipper just does not wanna believe his country
can act lie an ARSOLE. but it does.

Flipper "kicks ass" with all his quotes and hiding behind the
Establishment which manages to let **** HAPPEN big time, eg, the BP
oil spill in the Gulf. There was an oil wellblow out here off West
Aust a coule of years before, industry and governments just cannot be
trusted, so when Fliiper goes to such trouble to change my mind he
merely cements my hate for Governments and agencies and big ****in
business who try to appear to be doing something while poisoned air,
water, and land all continue and increase.

It seems to me 50,000 ppl have no clue why humans were put here on
Earth. I do not believe any single one of them has explained it. Maybe
they are Entirely Lost. The trouble with Lost People is that they are
likely to be irrational and agressive, and will put war before peace
in all arguments.tThe vocal types here might believe the world began
7,000 years ago, after God said he wanted to have blokes and shielas
spread acoss Earth, consuming and killing everything in their way.
Anyway, blokes&shielas are doing just that. And soon they'll be a
Rapture, and the good go up, and bad go down, and so on, depending on
which preacher you listen to..
With such crazy reasoning, its no wonder the USA is in so much trouble
with so many problems. But don't get me wrong, much of the best of
anything has come from the USA. But one of the worst tendencies is
that there are those who fail to see the negatives when they look in
the mirror.

A couple of cosmically very short centuries ago someone invented a
steam engine, and then it wasn't long before factory workers were
being killed by machines that blew up or mangled them. The road toll
got worse when travel speeds increased, and so it came to be that
technology has its down sides. Many thousands shoot each other dead or
die in road traumas. All avoidable, if there was a will, and people
were educated to believe that materialism and affluence is a flawed
state, and that what really matters is medical care and health, and
peace.

In another 10 cosmically short centuries, there's a huge chance of
very large amounts of **** to Happen, and I'm glad I won't be here to
witness it. I think there will be profound discoveries and
applications of technology in future. Flippers's grandchildren may be
able to purchase Gene Therapy to change themslves to say, eat garbage,
absorb CO2, and breathe out O2, while also having all trace of natural
organic brains removed so it may be replaced with brains 10,000 times
more able to think. I predict ever more negative consequences will
beset each positive step the grand kiddies make, so + and - are set to
continue battles as they always have, probably all within a world
without much nature at all. I'm happy I didn't have any kids because
what awaits humanity and hu-womanity is that they become un-human and
not bound by random evolution, but by artificial evolution and
artificial intelligence. To survive long term we will have to become
un-human. So what we think matters now does not matter. But the pain
of the consequences of short term policies do matter.

Patrick Turner.

[Lord Valve]

Patrick Turner grunted, strained, and squeezed out a pile of epic
proportion:

A staggeringly huge mound of fertilizer is mercifully excised...
but underneath the pile, a diamond is discovered:

I'm happy I didn't have any kids

Don't tell anyone, but so is everyone else.

The gene pool has enough **** floating
in it as it is, and the offspring of one more
leftist ****tard may well be the turd that
prompts The Man Upstairs to pull the
handle and flush the whole mess down
the dunny.


Lord Valve
Environment-destroying avaricious American businessman

[[email protected]]

On Jul 5, 12:32*pm, Lord Valve wrote:
Patrick Turner grunted, strained, and squeezed out a pile of epic
proportion:

A staggeringly huge mound of fertilizer is mercifully excised...
but underneath the pile, a diamond is discovered:

*I'm happy I didn't have any kids

Don't tell anyone, but so is everyone else.

The gene pool has enough **** floating
in it as it is, and the offspring of one more
leftist ****tard may well be the turd that
prompts The Man Upstairs to pull the
handle and flush the whole mess down
the dunny.

Lord Valve
Environment-destroying avaricious American businessman

You must be an EPA public relations rep . For real .

[Patrick Turner]

On Jul 6, 2:32*am, Lord Valve wrote:
Patrick Turner grunted, strained, and squeezed out a pile of epic
proportion:

A staggeringly huge mound of fertilizer is mercifully excised...
but underneath the pile, a diamond is discovered:

*I'm happy I didn't have any kids

Don't tell anyone, but so is everyone else.

The gene pool has enough **** floating
in it as it is, and the offspring of one more
leftist ****tard may well be the turd that
prompts The Man Upstairs to pull the
handle and flush the whole mess down
the dunny.

Lord Valve
Environment-destroying avaricious American businessman

But there is no evidence of a Man Upstairs.

I am very happy to not have had children who'd have to put up with
"Environment-destroying avaricious American businessman"

There are sure plenty of these right wing arsoles around.
Unfortunately some get into positions of power within a democracy.
They usually make so many mistakes they are rejected by electors,
while never ever admitting they were wrong.

I don't believe the God you relate to exists. There is a God, but its
real nature is indefinable; the definition of God is at least
infinite, and will not fit into little brains of humans, especially
any brains with Lord Valve genes within. So because your god don't
exist, and the logistics of heavenly chain pulling and cosmic dunny
operation have yet to be defined, then your summation of me as a
leftist fuctard is mere amusement to me, and without any intellectual
merit I can detect.

In the fullness of time all of Lord Valve's pet theories about all
other people will come to mean a big fat zero, just like everyone
else's pet theories, including my own, especially when we will be DEAD
sooner rather than later.

I spoke to a girl of 18 at the check out of a supermarket yesterday. I
started with "I thought they outlawed plastic carry bags last week" as
she puts stuff I'd bought into plastic bags. She didn't seems to know
why. The local government had placed an official ban on shopping bags
because its evirnomentally evil. Bags get into rivers and into fish
and are painful silent killers of aquatic animals. Generally, humans
do NOT dispose of plastic products properly. The girl mentioned the
production of plastic bags involves the operation of a filthy plastics
industry. OK, she's slightly informed, but I said that if I drove 10km
in my little car, I'd use petrol which would be the result of a
drilling and refining industry, also rather filthy, and the drive is
equivalent perhaps to 200 bags. If I drive 300km to Sydney, maybe its
the equal to thousands of shopping bags, so the few I use each week at
the shop is not a big problem, no?. I explained to her every single
action of being alive is **technically wrong** because it involves
unsustainable and unjustifiable and inevitable degradation of the
environment. Just how bad each and everything everyone does should be
considered by each person each day IMHO. I mentioned this and I think
she'll considerate it all but when she gets pregnant like most shielas
do at about 30 after falling in love et all, then the survival genes
kick in the environment can go **** itself to death as long as the kid
survives. That's motherhood for you. Blokes then proceed to consume
more and ****ing more and lead ever absurdly materialistic lives which
have utterly no meaning they could explain. Life just is. That's
enough for most blokes. **** the environment. Have 3 more beers. Have
a ****. Pull the chain.

OK, so nothing really matters and the environment is ****ed up during
the next 20 generations, and some how mankind gets up to 25 billion
ppl and we find ways to squeeze a living from the environment, maybe
by changing our genetics big time to cope. I mentioned to our dear
little shop girl that all present reasons for existance and
circumstances of existance will dramatically change in the future and
in ways so utterly inimaginable that its no use worrying about the
distant future, and whatever we do to ensure a better future does not
matter either, because of the nature of the future. Completely new
technologies we cannot imagine will be invented within 20 generations,
ie, by about 500 years time, and probably each 7 "steps forward" will
be accompanied by "5 steps backward". We invented computers and
implemented them during the last 70 years and one of their first uses
was in germany where they were used to keep track killing jews.
Anyway, such short term negative side effects were not too much
repeated, and then we were promised loads of spare time because the
*new age* inventions would give us 3 day working weeks with 4 days
leisure, but that all didn't happen and mortgage payments and economic
misery persisted. Right wing optimism so often was a complete mirage
equally as bad as leftwing predictions, and right wing swindlers at
Lehmans carried on and there was a horrible GFC. It looks possible the
US won't be able to pay its debts, and things look set to get worse.
Right wingers don't have solutions for the SHORT TERM WHICH REALLY
ONLY MATTERS to most ppl. regardless of whether they are leftist,
rightist, or undecided, like our dear young shop girl who has not had
the time to weigh things up very much yet, if she ever does. I bet if
you think back to when you were 18 that you didn't think very much
about anything, just about work, beer, a ****, a dollar.

Humanity usually does too little too late about slow moving problems
lifke greenhouse CO2 and general environmental degradation. The slow
moving problems are slow enough they can all be denied to be problems
at all, and can be even described as the result of leftwing ideology,
or as Nazi propaganda. OK, I'm not here to change the inertia of the
uneducated about worldy matters. I just know about tubes. But during
the next 500 years we'll stumble on, and suffer side effects of our
supposed progress, much of which is entirely vain and wastefull. Its
no use thinking of another 5,000 years, or 50,000 years. At present
rates of change I doubt anyone would recognise Earth if they could
time travel forward 50,000 years. But by 500,000 years its expected
that the world will fry to a crisp as the Sun runs its course and gets
hotter and much bigger before it dies to form an ultra dense neutron
star about the size of a grapefruit. So all life is ultimately
pointless if there is a finite end to it all, except that away from
our little tiny insignificant Solar System life elsewhere probably
exists with an alarmingly large quantity. The consideration that life
will end anyway is used to justify all poisoning of the environment
and the ruination of short term existance of living things, just as
long as shareholders are happy. Well, for me that's not quite good
enough, and sure, I ****ed a lotta sheilas, but I am content I didn't
breed. Only the grossly stupid and uneducated would classify me as
leftist.

Patrick Turner.

[Lord Valve]

Patrick Turner wrote:

On Jul 6, 2:32 am, Lord Valve wrote:
Patrick Turner grunted, strained, and squeezed out a pile of epic
proportion:

A staggeringly huge mound of fertilizer is mercifully excised...
but underneath the pile, a diamond is discovered:

I'm happy I didn't have any kids

Don't tell anyone, but so is everyone else.

The gene pool has enough **** floating
in it as it is, and the offspring of one more
leftist ****tard may well be the turd that
prompts The Man Upstairs to pull the
handle and flush the whole mess down
the dunny.

Lord Valve
Environment-destroying avaricious American businessman

But there is no evidence of a Man Upstairs.

There's no evidence there ain't one, either - Mexican standoff.

I am very happy to not have had children who'd have to put up with
"Environment-destroying avaricious American businessman"

We agree, then: more stuff for me!

There are sure plenty of these right wing arsoles around.
Unfortunately some get into positions of power within a democracy.
They usually make so many mistakes they are rejected by electors,
while never ever admitting they were wrong.

I don't believe the God you relate to exists. There is a God, but its
real nature is indefinable; the definition of God is at least
infinite, and will not fit into little brains of humans, especially
any brains with Lord Valve genes within. So because your god don't
exist, and the logistics of heavenly chain pulling and cosmic dunny
operation have yet to be defined, then your summation of me as a
leftist fuctard is mere amusement to me, and without any intellectual
merit I can detect.

I'm glad you enjoyed it.

It was dead solid accurate.

In the fullness of time all of Lord Valve's pet theories about all
other people will come to mean a big fat zero, just like everyone
else's pet theories, including my own, especially when we will be DEAD
sooner rather than later.

What a cheerful person you are.

I spoke to a girl of 18 at the check out of a supermarket yesterday. I
started with "I thought they outlawed plastic carry bags last week" as
she puts stuff I'd bought into plastic bags. She didn't seems to know
why. The local government had placed an official ban on shopping bags
because its evirnomentally evil. Bags get into rivers and into fish
and are painful silent killers of aquatic animals. Generally, humans
do NOT dispose of plastic products properly. The girl mentioned the
production of plastic bags involves the operation of a filthy plastics
industry.

Nothing better than filthy plastics. I use plenty of 'em.

OK, she's slightly informed, but I said that if I drove 10km
in my little car, I'd use petrol which would be the result of a
drilling and refining industry, also rather filthy, and the drive is
equivalent perhaps to 200 bags. If I drive 300km to Sydney, maybe its
the equal to thousands of shopping bags, so the few I use each week at
the shop is not a big problem, no?. I explained to her every single
action of being alive is **technically wrong** because it involves
unsustainable and unjustifiable and inevitable degradation of the
environment.

And there, ladies and gentlemen, you have it.

THIS dude is a sphincter of legendary proportion,
a walkin'-talkin' asshole, a veritable fount of leftist
****e. They all play this game - we should ALL DIE,
we don't belong here, we're killing everything, etc.
As if we didn't evolve (or whatever) alongside every
other organism on this ****ing mudball, right next
to everything from pond scum to blue whales. These
fools think we're *guilty* of something for being the
*best* survivors on the planet. We're not entiltled
to resource du jour because there's some ****ing
BUG that needs it, and the BUG takes precedence.
Humans be damned, we're a *disease*, and socialism
is - if not the cure, at least a palliative.

**** these assholes.


Just how bad each and everything everyone does should be
considered by each person each day IMHO. I mentioned this and I think
she'll considerate it all but when she gets pregnant like most shielas
do at about 30 after falling in love et all, then the survival genes
kick in the environment can go **** itself to death as long as the kid
survives.

Absolutely right.

It's a built-in survival mechanism shared by everything
that breathes, *especially* mammals. Good for us -
we're kicking reptile and animal ass. Kill 'em and grill
'em, whack 'em and stack 'em. WE EAT FIRST, and
everything else gets leftovers and sloppy seconds. If
humans are to continue on this rock, we need to be
the best killers and farmers on it. And we are.

**** you if you don't like it, asswipe.

That's motherhood for you.

Yes, it's obvious - you think your own mom is a piece of crap.

shrug

Blokes then proceed to consume
more and ****ing more and lead ever absurdly materialistic lives which
have utterly no meaning they could explain. Life just is. That's
enough for most blokes. **** the environment. Have 3 more beers. Have
a ****. Pull the chain.

You are welcome to consume less than everyone else.

In fact, if you kill yourself, you won't consume *anything*,
and you'll become a valuable source of food for worms,
beetles, grubs, bacteria, and all those other life-forms
you consider to be superior to Man. Go on, dude...do
your duty. Choose a caliber, suck the muzzle, drop the
hammer. Your kind *can* save "the environment," one
retard at a time. BANG! Gaia thanks you. Next?

OK, so nothing really matters and the environment is ****ed up during
the next 20 generations, and some how mankind gets up to 25 billion
ppl and we find ways to squeeze a living from the environment, maybe
by changing our genetics big time to cope.

One thing you ecotards all share is your fixation with mud.

You think that the glob you're standing on is the only
game in town, that there's only one pie and the more
humans there are, the smaller everyone's slice will
be.

Nonsense.

There are quadrillions of tonnes of resources in just
our own solar system. The amount available in just
our own galaxy is so huge there is probably no way
to even estimate it. And there are trillions of galaxies.
But no - ecotards are content to sit crying in their
beer (oops...make that recycled filtered ****) about
how we're running out of everything.

Like I said - ****tards.

I mentioned to our dear
little shop girl that all present reasons for existance and
circumstances of existance will dramatically change in the future and
in ways so utterly inimaginable that its no use worrying about the
distant future, and whatever we do to ensure a better future does not
matter either, because of the nature of the future.

Pull the trigger.

Completely new
technologies we cannot imagine will be invented within 20 generations,
ie, by about 500 years time, and probably each 7 "steps forward" will
be accompanied by "5 steps backward". We invented computers and
implemented them during the last 70 years and one of their first uses
was in germany where they were used to keep track killing jews.
Anyway, such short term negative side effects were not too much
repeated, and then we were promised loads of spare time because the
*new age* inventions would give us 3 day working weeks with 4 days
leisure, but that all didn't happen and mortgage payments and economic
misery persisted. Right wing optimism so often was a complete mirage
equally as bad as leftwing predictions, and right wing swindlers at
Lehmans carried on and there was a horrible GFC. It looks possible the
US won't be able to pay its debts, and things look set to get worse.

Yes, the problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of someone
else's money.

Right wingers don't have solutions for the SHORT TERM WHICH REALLY
ONLY MATTERS to most ppl. regardless of whether they are leftist,
rightist, or undecided, like our dear young shop girl who has not had
the time to weigh things up very much yet, if she ever does. I bet if
you think back to when you were 18 that you didn't think very much
about anything, just about work, beer, a ****, a dollar.

You're an idiot.

Don't project your own youthful irrelevence on others.
The fact that your existence was worthless doesn't
reflect at all on those who were industrious.

Humanity usually does too little too late about slow moving problems
lifke greenhouse CO2

That's bull****. shrug

and general environmental degradation.

Kill yourself (see above).

The slow
moving problems are slow enough they can all be denied to be problems
at all, and can be even described as the result of leftwing ideology,
or as Nazi propaganda. OK, I'm not here to change the inertia of the
uneducated about worldy matters. I just know about tubes. But during
the next 500 years we'll stumble on, and suffer side effects of our
supposed progress, much of which is entirely vain and wastefull. Its
no use thinking of another 5,000 years, or 50,000 years. At present
rates of change I doubt anyone would recognise Earth if they could
time travel forward 50,000 years. But by 500,000 years its expected
that the world will fry to a crisp as the Sun runs its course and gets
hotter and much bigger before it dies to form an ultra dense neutron
star about the size of a grapefruit.

You are an *idiot*. That's wrong by FOUR ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE!

How can you NOT know **** like this?

Our sun is about 4.5 billion years old. The majority
of scientific studies come to the same conclusion:
Sol is about halfway through its main sequence
existence, and it will be another 4.5 billion years
before it flares into the red giant stage, frying
everything out to about Saturn. You are MAKING
**** UP and then pontificating on your phony
data. You're a jerk - you have no idea what you're
talking about.

So all life is ultimately
pointless if there is a finite end to it all, except that away from
our little tiny insignificant Solar System life elsewhere probably
exists with an alarmingly large quantity. The consideration that life
will end anyway is used to justify all poisoning of the environment
and the ruination of short term existance of living things, just as
long as shareholders are happy. Well, for me that's not quite good
enough, and sure, I ****ed a lotta sheilas, but I am content I didn't
breed. Only the grossly stupid and uneducated would classify me as
leftist.

In that case, you must be grossly stupid and uneducated, for the tripe
you've posted here labels you as a leftist ****tard, sure as ****.

Save the environment - pull the trigger.


Lord Valve
Disgusted

[Patrick Turner]

And there, ladies and gentlemen, you have it.

THIS dude is a sphincter of legendary proportion,
a walkin'-talkin' asshole, a veritable fount of leftist
****e. *They all play this game - we should ALL DIE,
we don't belong here, we're killing everything, etc.
As if we didn't evolve (or whatever) alongside every
other organism on this ****ing mudball, right next
to everything from pond scum to blue whales. These
fools think we're *guilty* of something for being the
*best* survivors on the planet. *We're not entiltled
to resource du jour because there's some ****ing
BUG that needs it, and the BUG takes precedence.
Humans be damned, we're a *disease*, and socialism
is - if not the cure, at least a palliative.

**** these assholes.

Ah, there you go condemning me as a leftist arsole who condemns human
life. But your policies of life and politics that is condemning all
life to the dustbin much faster than mine, so who is worse for the
future, your kind or my kind? So please enjoy your application of the
"**** THESE ARSOLES" arsoles because its your policies on life which
are doing it to yourselves.

But don't worry, be happy, thankfully, you'll be dead and dead as I
will be quite soon in terms of Earth History. The Planet will get
hotter, environment all ****ed up so humanity prospers and nature
withers and becomes poisoned. Your future great great grat great
grandchildren might genetically change themselves to eat their own
****. You'd think food could be re-cycled like old output
transformers, no? Its a Green idea, leftist, but its what every
sensible human might need to do in 3011. The next ice age will be
avoided because of global warming, but lots of new areas in nth Europe
and Canada will allow human expansion and its immediate degradation.


Just how bad each and everything everyone does should be
considered by each person each day IMHO. I mentioned this and I think
she'll considerate it all but when she gets pregnant like most shielas
do at about 30 after falling in love et all, *then the survival genes
kick in the environment can go **** itself to death as long as the kid
survives.

Absolutely right.

It's a built-in survival mechanism shared by everything
that breathes, *especially* mammals. *Good for us -
we're kicking reptile and animal ass. *Kill 'em and grill
'em, whack 'em and stack 'em. *WE EAT FIRST, and
everything else gets leftovers and sloppy seconds. If
humans are to continue on this rock, we need to be
the best killers and farmers on it. *And we are.

**** you if you don't like it, asswipe.

Hehe, I got silly LV all hotted up and angry. Now ya said all that,
you don't have any chance to get elected to anywhere if you went into
politics, and Green candidates would do better. Just think, the world
ruled by LV. Laughable. you'd be assaninated within a week by ppl
applying your methods and rules.


That's motherhood for you.

Yes, it's obvious - you think your own mom is a piece of crap.

Mom's wonderful. But she's a very selfish woman. She used to tell me
not to be selfish while acting very selfishly. Your mom is the same. I
see motherhood and fatherhood as being about the same - a complex
interaction with no particularly high value in terms of cosmic
usefulness. The interactions are full of struggles and pain and human
dysfunction, sin, evil, regrets, as well as love, hope and all the
positives, just to name a few things about it all. You need to know
the universe isn't particularly better off just because you are in it.
Your mum gave birth to you because she was, like my mother, possessed
of her invincibility and self worth and full of love with the idea of
breeding, and selected your father to giver her the children she
craved because of her hormone driven directives. Most ppl fulfil
yearnings to breed, like all other living things. its basically
natural, and "good" in simple terms. All mostly driven by hormones,
and with little regard to rational thoughts about the BIG PICTURE.
This urge in the 1940's youth of the world to breed gave not the
slightest thought about their net effect on the planet; there were no
ideas around that gave anyone cause to think about limiting their
breeding, except the likely wars, disease, road toll, and so on.
Hormones pushed cocks into ****s more force than rational thoughts
kept them apart.

During evolution processes, humans cheated. We evolved brains that
gave us modern life and doctors and so suddenly most disease became
curable or avoidable, and then population exploded along with
degradation of all nature around us. We are reducing the number of
species at a rate that is greater than during past mass extinctions.
Nowdays women are becoming better educated and empowered and are
avoiding men like you. The birthrate in nations where women become
aware of ideas I am proposing is falling rapidly, and about time. So
what you see as the foundations of your philosophy of life is looking
cracked and fragile and your species is as vulnerable to change just
as the dinosoars 65mill years ago. Species don't last forever, but
while we do have our day, most agree life should be pleasant and not
get worse. So I am proposing ppl should stop breeding so furiously and
pointlessly and stop being so greedy like you. The dinosoars lost out
when a big rock hit Earth, but we are making the equivalent of our own
rock and we are sowing the seeds of our own demise. Its never been
seen before on Earth, so none of us can predict what might happen. But
in nature there are constant imbalances of species which seek balance,
but don't always finf it. Rabbits were not native to Oz. Some idiot
imported a few pairs of rabbits and by 1950 the rabbits were eating
more than everything else combined in Oz. They threatened viability of
farming. There was no natural predator. Balance was in favour of
rabbits. We have become like rabbits. It's neither good nor bad, but
sooner or later something limits growth and population. The paddock
gets too small and all the grass gets eaten. This apparently, you
can't see, because you froth at the mouth calling every thoughtful
person a fuctard. Sooner or later unlimited growth becomes limited by
some external factor or by natural conditions becoming so horrid that
continued growth is impossible, and perhaps a disease breaks out or
there is just so much **** around that life can't be as it was. In the
case of rabbits, scientists here invented a venereal disease to limit
rabbit breeding. Within a decade rabbits declined and the land
recovered. but they have developed a resistance to the germs now, and
are on the rise again. Its unlikely mankind will secumb to disease
like the Plagues in Europe because we like surviving and have thought
of 1,001 ways to enable it, fine, but we are polluting the planet. At
present about 1 billion have a good life but when the other 6 billion
try to get our kind of life then pressure on everything increases 6
times. I leave you to tell us all where 6 times more of everything is
going to come from.

No need for me to reply to one who below wishes me to commit suicide
with a gun. You are slowly dying like me, naturally, and there isn't
anything we may do to prevent it. You don't seem very happy Mr Valve,
and you seem to have to use a name which your mother didn't give you
in order to feel good in the world. I doubt she christened you "Lord
Valve". So to millions of people you look like an unhappy insecure
monster with a gun.
It is a pity so many ppl in the world think like this about America.
But you are not very dangerous though because all monsters breathing
hot air get old and weak and die. Only a few die with wisdom, because
many go stupid as they age and most monsters can be felled easily with
a small bullet if they become a nuisance.
Monsters can be fooled to fall into a pit.

Patrick Turner.

[Lord Valve]

I submit the following as evidence that Turner is
dumber than a two-dollar dog. (No offense to
dogs is intended.)

Lord Valve
American - and **** you if you don't like it.


Patrick Turner wrote:


And there, ladies and gentlemen, you have it.

THIS dude is a sphincter of legendary proportion,
a walkin'-talkin' asshole, a veritable fount of leftist
****e. They all play this game - we should ALL DIE,
we don't belong here, we're killing everything, etc.
As if we didn't evolve (or whatever) alongside every
other organism on this ****ing mudball, right next
to everything from pond scum to blue whales. These
fools think we're *guilty* of something for being the
*best* survivors on the planet. We're not entiltled
to resource du jour because there's some ****ing
BUG that needs it, and the BUG takes precedence.
Humans be damned, we're a *disease*, and socialism
is - if not the cure, at least a palliative.

**** these assholes.

Ah, there you go condemning me as a leftist arsole who condemns human
life. But your policies of life and politics that is condemning all
life to the dustbin much faster than mine, so who is worse for the
future, your kind or my kind? So please enjoy your application of the
"**** THESE ARSOLES" arsoles because its your policies on life which
are doing it to yourselves.

But don't worry, be happy, thankfully, you'll be dead and dead as I
will be quite soon in terms of Earth History. The Planet will get
hotter, environment all ****ed up so humanity prospers and nature
withers and becomes poisoned. Your future great great grat great
grandchildren might genetically change themselves to eat their own
****. You'd think food could be re-cycled like old output
transformers, no? Its a Green idea, leftist, but its what every
sensible human might need to do in 3011. The next ice age will be
avoided because of global warming, but lots of new areas in nth Europe
and Canada will allow human expansion and its immediate degradation.


Just how bad each and everything everyone does should be
considered by each person each day IMHO. I mentioned this and I think
she'll considerate it all but when she gets pregnant like most shielas
do at about 30 after falling in love et all, then the survival genes
kick in the environment can go **** itself to death as long as the kid
survives.

Absolutely right.

It's a built-in survival mechanism shared by everything
that breathes, *especially* mammals. Good for us -
we're kicking reptile and animal ass. Kill 'em and grill
'em, whack 'em and stack 'em. WE EAT FIRST, and
everything else gets leftovers and sloppy seconds. If
humans are to continue on this rock, we need to be
the best killers and farmers on it. And we are.

**** you if you don't like it, asswipe.

Hehe, I got silly LV all hotted up and angry. Now ya said all that,
you don't have any chance to get elected to anywhere if you went into
politics, and Green candidates would do better. Just think, the world
ruled by LV. Laughable. you'd be assaninated within a week by ppl
applying your methods and rules.


That's motherhood for you.

Yes, it's obvious - you think your own mom is a piece of crap.

Mom's wonderful. But she's a very selfish woman. She used to tell me
not to be selfish while acting very selfishly. Your mom is the same. I
see motherhood and fatherhood as being about the same - a complex
interaction with no particularly high value in terms of cosmic
usefulness. The interactions are full of struggles and pain and human
dysfunction, sin, evil, regrets, as well as love, hope and all the
positives, just to name a few things about it all. You need to know
the universe isn't particularly better off just because you are in it.
Your mum gave birth to you because she was, like my mother, possessed
of her invincibility and self worth and full of love with the idea of
breeding, and selected your father to giver her the children she
craved because of her hormone driven directives. Most ppl fulfil
yearnings to breed, like all other living things. its basically
natural, and "good" in simple terms. All mostly driven by hormones,
and with little regard to rational thoughts about the BIG PICTURE.
This urge in the 1940's youth of the world to breed gave not the
slightest thought about their net effect on the planet; there were no
ideas around that gave anyone cause to think about limiting their
breeding, except the likely wars, disease, road toll, and so on.
Hormones pushed cocks into ****s more force than rational thoughts
kept them apart.

During evolution processes, humans cheated. We evolved brains that
gave us modern life and doctors and so suddenly most disease became
curable or avoidable, and then population exploded along with
degradation of all nature around us. We are reducing the number of
species at a rate that is greater than during past mass extinctions.
Nowdays women are becoming better educated and empowered and are
avoiding men like you. The birthrate in nations where women become
aware of ideas I am proposing is falling rapidly, and about time. So
what you see as the foundations of your philosophy of life is looking
cracked and fragile and your species is as vulnerable to change just
as the dinosoars 65mill years ago. Species don't last forever, but
while we do have our day, most agree life should be pleasant and not
get worse. So I am proposing ppl should stop breeding so furiously and
pointlessly and stop being so greedy like you. The dinosoars lost out
when a big rock hit Earth, but we are making the equivalent of our own
rock and we are sowing the seeds of our own demise. Its never been
seen before on Earth, so none of us can predict what might happen. But
in nature there are constant imbalances of species which seek balance,
but don't always finf it. Rabbits were not native to Oz. Some idiot
imported a few pairs of rabbits and by 1950 the rabbits were eating
more than everything else combined in Oz. They threatened viability of
farming. There was no natural predator. Balance was in favour of
rabbits. We have become like rabbits. It's neither good nor bad, but
sooner or later something limits growth and population. The paddock
gets too small and all the grass gets eaten. This apparently, you
can't see, because you froth at the mouth calling every thoughtful
person a fuctard. Sooner or later unlimited growth becomes limited by
some external factor or by natural conditions becoming so horrid that
continued growth is impossible, and perhaps a disease breaks out or
there is just so much **** around that life can't be as it was. In the
case of rabbits, scientists here invented a venereal disease to limit
rabbit breeding. Within a decade rabbits declined and the land
recovered. but they have developed a resistance to the germs now, and
are on the rise again. Its unlikely mankind will secumb to disease
like the Plagues in Europe because we like surviving and have thought
of 1,001 ways to enable it, fine, but we are polluting the planet. At
present about 1 billion have a good life but when the other 6 billion
try to get our kind of life then pressure on everything increases 6
times. I leave you to tell us all where 6 times more of everything is
going to come from.

No need for me to reply to one who below wishes me to commit suicide
with a gun. You are slowly dying like me, naturally, and there isn't
anything we may do to prevent it. You don't seem very happy Mr Valve,
and you seem to have to use a name which your mother didn't give you
in order to feel good in the world. I doubt she christened you "Lord
Valve". So to millions of people you look like an unhappy insecure
monster with a gun.
It is a pity so many ppl in the world think like this about America.
But you are not very dangerous though because all monsters breathing
hot air get old and weak and die. Only a few die with wisdom, because
many go stupid as they age and most monsters can be felled easily with
a small bullet if they become a nuisance.
Monsters can be fooled to fall into a pit.

Patrick Turner.

[Don[_4_]]

In article ,
(LV)says...
You think that the glob you're standing on is the only
game in town, that there's only one pie and the more
humans there are, the smaller everyone's slice will
be.

Nonsense.

There are quadrillions of tonnes of resources in just
our own solar system. The amount available in just
our own galaxy is so huge there is probably no way
to even estimate it. And there are trillions of galaxies.
But no - ecotards are content to sit crying in their
beer (oops...make that recycled filtered ****) about
how we're running out of everything.

LV, I think you have too many science fiction novels.
Let me know when the UFO's land.

[Lord Valve]

Don wrote:

In article ,
(LV)says...
You think that the glob you're standing on is the only
game in town, that there's only one pie and the more
humans there are, the smaller everyone's slice will
be.

Nonsense.

There are quadrillions of tonnes of resources in just
our own solar system. The amount available in just
our own galaxy is so huge there is probably no way
to even estimate it. And there are trillions of galaxies.
But no - ecotards are content to sit crying in their
beer (oops...make that recycled filtered ****) about
how we're running out of everything.

LV, I think you have too many science fiction novels.
Let me know when the UFO's land.

Oh, yes, of course.

"It's too hard." "It's impossible." "It costs too much."
There are any number of excuses for not doing
something. Much easier to sit on your ass and
wait for that little green check in the brown envelope
to show up in your mailbox. I understand. It's all
"science fiction."

Back in 1980, it was pure science fiction that
there would be a device which would enable one-
on-one telephone calls with real time video at
both ends, from any spot on the planet to any
other. Farfetched, eh? Today - only thirty years
later - people nonchalantly carry this very capability
*in their pockets*, and think nothing of using it.
It's as easy as turning the tap in the sink, and
it's used with as little thought as that given to
where the water comes from.

The technology with which to mine the asteroid
belt has existed since the 1950s. It's become
considerably refined since then, but it's still the
same technology. Yes, it will be horrendously
expensive to begin with. (Anyone remember
when blue LEDs first showed up? If you wanted
one, it cost the better part of a hundred bucks.
Now, you can buy 'em for less than fifty cents.
Science fiction, right?)

"We choose to go to the moon. We choose to
go to the moon in this decade and do the
other things, not because they are easy,
but because they are hard, because that
goal will serve to organize and measure
the best of our energies and skills,
because that challenge is one that we are
willing to accept, one we are unwilling
to postpone, and one which we intend to
win, and the others, too. It is for these
reasons that I regard the decision last
year to shift our efforts in space from
low to high gear as among the most
important decisions that will be made
during my incumbency in the Office of
the Presidency." - JFK

Of course, the current ****tard in Chief
doesn't care a rat's ass for space
development.

He's too busy stuffing down wings and
lobsters and shooting hoops to **** with
any of that science fiction stuff. And folks
like you - scoffers - certainly won't help
get the job done. If not the USA, then
certainly someone else.

The Chinese, for instance.

Your argument, if I infer it correctly, is that
it'll take too long or cost too much.

Bull****.

That's the same crap the ecotards keep
spewing about drilling for oil in ANWR and
other places within the USA: "It'll take ten
years for any oil to come online." Yeah, it
will...and the ecotards have been throwing
wrenches in the gears for twenty years now,
and if we'd started drilling ANWR ten years
ago like we should have, we'd have that oil
NOW and we could begin to tell nasty ****wads
like Chavez to EAT their oil.

Waiting buys nothing.

Lord Valve
Futurist

[Lord Valve]

flipper wrote:

On Fri, 08 Jul 2011 11:25:49 -0600, Lord Valve
wrote:

Don wrote:

In article ,
(LV)says...
You think that the glob you're standing on is the only
game in town, that there's only one pie and the more
humans there are, the smaller everyone's slice will
be.

Nonsense.

There are quadrillions of tonnes of resources in just
our own solar system. The amount available in just
our own galaxy is so huge there is probably no way
to even estimate it. And there are trillions of galaxies.
But no - ecotards are content to sit crying in their
beer (oops...make that recycled filtered ****) about
how we're running out of everything.

LV, I think you have too many science fiction novels.
Let me know when the UFO's land.

Oh, yes, of course.

"It's too hard." "It's impossible." "It costs too much."
There are any number of excuses for not doing
something. Much easier to sit on your ass and
wait for that little green check in the brown envelope
to show up in your mailbox. I understand. It's all
"science fiction."

Back in 1980, it was pure science fiction that
there would be a device which would enable one-
on-one telephone calls with real time video at
both ends, from any spot on the planet to any
other. Farfetched, eh? Today - only thirty years
later - people nonchalantly carry this very capability
*in their pockets*, and think nothing of using it.
It's as easy as turning the tap in the sink, and
it's used with as little thought as that given to
where the water comes from.

I agree with the gist of the example but it's amusing to note that
Bell Telephone had been trying to make 'video phones' from almost the
beginning.

As someone who has more than a few decades under his belt I can
remember the (failed) big push for 'video phones' and if you recall
the 1969 (I think it was) movie 2001 our protagonist calls home from
the space station on one, in a 'phone booth' of course.

In fact, I do remember something about early videophone tech.

The National Geographic Society had a primitive one set up
in their "Explorer's Hall" museum in Washington, DC, which
is where I grew up. It was tethered to another unit in some
other city - Chicago? LA? - and you could book time on
it; the person on the other end had to show up on time and
be ready for the connection. I don't remember how much
it cost, but I do remember seeing it in their building. I had
a subscription to National Geographic Magazine courtesy
of Grandma, and they did an article on it. They probably
had a dedicated coax line with repeaters. I'm sure the
Bell System was involved. (The *real* phone company,
not the disgusting mash of crap we have now.... ;-)

But that wasn't the 'beginning' either. Back in the late 1920s Bell
experimented with 'large screen' television, mechanical of all things,
and, what else, a 'combined' video/telephone system

http://www.earlytelevision.org/bell_labs.html

What a monstrosity. Probably still works. ;-)

I'm sure someone at the time made an 'analysis' and explained how none
of that could ever come to be but, as you point out, we carry the
things in our pockets these days.

I'm sure the "2-way wrist TV" shown in the Dick Tracy strips is just around
the corner...

Lord Valve
Old Fart

[Lord Valve]

flipper wrote:

On Fri, 08 Jul 2011 12:18:32 -0400, Don
wrote:

In article ,
(LV)says...
You think that the glob you're standing on is the only
game in town, that there's only one pie and the more
humans there are, the smaller everyone's slice will
be.

Nonsense.

There are quadrillions of tonnes of resources in just
our own solar system. The amount available in just
our own galaxy is so huge there is probably no way
to even estimate it. And there are trillions of galaxies.
But no - ecotards are content to sit crying in their
beer (oops...make that recycled filtered ****) about
how we're running out of everything.

LV, I think you have too many science fiction novels.
Let me know when the UFO's land.


Pardon me but observing there is a whole universe out there has
nothing to do with postulating 'space aliens'.

The Fermi Parodox aside, it's hard to imagine that there *aren't*, given
the sheer numbers of stars in the universe.

Whether we have anything they want is another
story, as is whether there is any way to visit or
even communicate with any of them. There are
hints (small, but real) that some sort of "warp
drive" may be possible. "First contact" would
be a society-shattering event; there are protocols
in place at the UN for this, and probably also in
every technologically advanced nation. Hell,
Las Vegas outfits have odds for first contact,
and will take bets on it. (So far, the house is
making out like a bandit. ;-) I'm not holding
my breath, though.

LV may be looking a little farther into the future but the gist is
correct. There is no "fixed pie" unless you stop baking them.

While tempting, the 'fixed pie' analogy doesn't work even if one
restricts themselves to 'just earth' because it presumes, as Malthus
did, that everything is done exactly the same way forever but that has
been proven wrong so many times it isn't even funny anymore.

Malthus was predicting mass starvation but virtually nothing is done
the way he presumed. We don't farm like before. Processing is
infinitely more efficient than before. We don't pack and ship like
before. Food doesn't spoil like before. And we could go on and on.

Even the presumption you can 'know' what the 'limited resources' are
is fallacious. For example, today we farm on what Malthus called non
arable land. We use metals where wood was once used, we use plastics,
cement, and ceramics where metals were once used, and we extract
minerals from places no one thought possible or even knew were there.

As far as 'the earth' goes we have, to make a pun on mining, quite
literally 'hardly scratched the surface'.and who's to say that in 100
years we won't be Star Trek beaming minerals up from 100 miles down or
'assembling matter' from pure energy?

You can call it 'science fiction' but a big chunk of what we blithely
use today was beyond even the imagining 100 years ago; like a computer
(what's a computer?) in your pocket.

The asteroid belt has material for a *lot* of pie.

Find a nice-sized one that has goodies in it that you
need, give it a shove in the right direction. If you
need it soon, you shove it hard. If you can wait,
you just tap it a bit. When it shows up in your
vicinity, you can smack it down on the Moon, or
brake it into orbit (L5 is nice) and mine it. Solar
energy is abundant, makes no mess at all, is
available (in space) 24/7/365, and costs almost
nothing, once the means to collect it have been built.
Hell, you could do advanced smelting, refining,
distillation and other industrial processes with
nothing more complicated than a bunch of mirrors.
With almost free and almost unlimited electricity
available, cargo delivery via railgun becomes
feasible. The High Frontier is where it's AT,
folks. All we have to do is haul our ass off this
rock and go get all the stuff we'll ever need..


There is no "fixed pie," unless you stop baking them.

I can see my slice; I just can't reach it yet. ;-)


Lord Valve
Futurist

[Patrick Turner]

On Jul 9, 2:18*am, Don wrote:
In article ,
(LV)says...
You think that the glob you're standing on is the only
game in town, that there's only one pie and the more
humans there are, the smaller everyone's slice will
be.

Nonsense.

There are quadrillions of tonnes of resources in just
our own solar system. *The amount available in just
our own galaxy is so huge there is probably no way
to even estimate it. *And there are trillions of galaxies.
But no - ecotards are content to sit crying in their
beer (oops...make that recycled filtered ****) about
how we're running out of everything.

LV, I think you have too many science fiction novels.
Let me know when the UFO's land.

Unfortunately, mankind looks certain to trash the Planet well before
developing the means to gain access to the bounty of unlimited
resources scattered across the rest of the galaxy.
Look how much NASA's Space Schuttle cost to run, and what a failure!
They wanted regular fortnight space flights but managed only a few a
year, and look how much it cost. Just imagine being dependant for
millions of tonnes of supplies from Planet X some 200 million light
years away.

We have only ONE planet to sustain all of the future we can reasonably
forsee. Its possible we might unlock secrets of producing millions of
times the amount of energy needed for interplanetary travel, and maybe
we might even travel millions of times the speed of light, maybe like
God does, because one would expect God to know what's happening NOW at
all parts of the known and unknown universe and universes outside our
own. Space travel for resource shopping would be limited by the
acceleration effects on the human body. But the Greens and ecologists
know you can't depend on fanciful thinking to come true soon enough.

The evil left wing Green thinkers are right, and their thoughts are
correct about our demise IF we don't change our frightful horrid
greedy over-consumption of everything within a generation or two. I
don't care how much LV swears and curses about ppl who think
differently to him; he's welcome to make a fool of himself while
denying there's a big future problem exists for which he has no
answers. He'll die, and those who are young will never remember him,
because they'll be too concerned with problems of existance.

But The US is worried it cannot pay its debts, and if there is a
Depression, then kiss the US goodbye for a good long time at least.
They've spent $4.4 trillion on ME wars in 10 years, and what can they
show for it? I've seen US soldiers doing some mighty fine work in Iraq
and Ghan, most wonderful, but that's not enough, and the cost
outweighs the benefits to the US. Seems to me the handful of terrorist
arsoles in ME have won, because they made the US spend so much.
Don't ever expect the US to practise best environmental practices
because to do so would reduce the living standards of all. Profits
have been more important than a good environment. With even more
pressure on living standards with a Depression, if there is one, then
even less respect will be paid to keeping the environment in good
order.

Don't Worry, Be Happy, Wars and Pestilences and Crap will keep
happening as it has for all previous human history, due to argy bargy
over resources, land, water, and the now, the climate. Life is tragic.

Patrick Turner.

[Don[_4_]]

Your argument, if I infer it correctly, is that
it'll take too long or cost too much.

Bull****.

....
Lord Valve
Futurist



Nope, I think that the eroei ratio wont work for mining the asteroids.
Metals aren't really the problem, anyways. Energy and politics are the
problem.

[Patrick Turner]

Mr Valve says.....
*Solar
energy is abundant, makes no mess at all, is
available (in space) 24/7/365, and costs almost
nothing, once the means to collect it have been built.
Hell, you could do advanced smelting, refining,
distillation and other industrial processes with
nothing more complicated than a bunch of mirrors.
With almost free and almost unlimited electricity
available, cargo delivery via railgun becomes
feasible. *The High Frontier is where it's AT,
folks. *All we have to do is haul our ass off this
rock and go get all the stuff we'll ever need..

There is no "fixed pie," unless you stop baking them.

I can see my slice; I just can't reach it yet. *;-)

You and your childrens' children will all live and die before space
travel for resource shopping gives you your slice of pie in the sky.

Mankind needs to learn to get from NOW to LATER without trashing the
planet, so he needs to adopt all green thinking ASAP.
If you wish to call me an arsole and to say horrid things about my
mother because you don't like Green Thinking, then you are free to say
so but the world will take not a bit of notice of you; you are merely
a farting arsole which will die soon, and all your anti social
behaviour will be forgotten.

Much vested interests in coal mining and power generation, Big Coal,
Big Gas, Big Energy, Big Chemicals, and all manner of Big Capitalist
****heads are all against the changes to the Status Quo and costs
involved to changing to GREEN IDEAS.

Much research is being done to capture solar power with mirrors here
on Earth. On this we may agree slightly.
But although we are surrounded with abundance of everything, none of
it is free, and getting any of it will cost us dearly, and noboby
wants to pay; they'd all rather keep old ways going, lest "everyone be
rooned".

But here at the Australian National University, more is being done
constructively than anying Mr ****ing Valve could ever suggest....
http://solar-thermal.anu.edu.au/


Tommorrow, our Labor Government will announce the Carbon Tax
introduction and funding of compensation to low wage earners, and
funding to back alternative GREEN energy productions.

The Right Wing Opposition is going ballistic with negativity about
what's happening, just like you, foaming at the mouth, wishing the
worst for left wing mothers, and that's OK. Every NEW WAY needs to be
opposed democratically so that overtime the voters get to judge what
is really right for them. Chances are that in 2013 when the next
Federal Election is due that ppl of Oz get to see if the Carbon Tax is
pushing everyone off the use of carbon for energy. OK, if it has made
NO difference to C02, and reduced living standards dramatically, then
the Opposition will win. Its an experiment we can afford, despite
claims living standards will fall. But Oz living standards have not
suffered during the GFC because of our trade with China. So, lets see
what happens.
But even if an Opposition dis-mantles what the Government is
introducing, the problem of CO2 won't be going away, and Greens will
keep thinking the same, and voting the same way.

I still believe humanity will do too little too late about reducing
CO2 emissions. Until someone prooves otherwise, I will keep believing
in stuff that Mr ****ing Valve really hates.

Patrick Turner.