Any questions?

What does this have to do with audio?

Kendall

Hey, why don't you tell me why it doesn't apply to audio or to life as a
business in the first place. Tell me how what I'm talking about doesn't
effect your business, or others.

But then I guess you have only one thought in your mind, that being that
nothing that has to do with events today has anything to do with your
business. You'd much rather find out for free whether a 4050 sounds better
than a KSM 27 or whether 6" off the kick is better tha 5" or 7", all without
simply applying some of the stuff you've heard here in the first place.

What it has to do with audio is that without a society that can do audio,
there will only be Telefunkens on Bush's podium and people will march off to
wherever they march off to. And in case you didn't notice, people are
already marching off to where they march off to.

So that's what it has to do with audio.

"The saddest thing is that I didn't say anything at all."

--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio

"Kendall" wrote in message
om...
Any questions?

What does this have to do with audio?

Kendall

"Roger W. Norman" wrote in message
...

Here, I'll fix where you top-posted to my reply so that the context couldn't
easily be followed-

You said:

Any questions?


To which I replied:

What does this have to do with audio?

To which you re-replied:


Hey, why don't you tell me why it doesn't apply to audio or to life as a
business in the first place. Tell me how what I'm talking about doesn't
effect your business, or others.

But then I guess you have only one thought in your mind, that being that
nothing that has to do with events today has anything to do with your
business. You'd much rather find out for free whether a 4050 sounds
better
than a KSM 27 or whether 6" off the kick is better tha 5" or 7", all
without
simply applying some of the stuff you've heard here in the first place.

What it has to do with audio is that without a society that can do audio,
there will only be Telefunkens on Bush's podium and people will march off
to
wherever they march off to. And in case you didn't notice, people are
already marching off to where they march off to.

So that's what it has to do with audio.

"The saddest thing is that I didn't say anything at all."

Now, that we have all that in context, let me state that I did not read most
of your original post, once I realized it didn't relate to audio. I did,
however catch your final question, and I replied with my question. In your
answer here, I can see that yes, from a certain standpoint you do have some
relevant points. However, that is NOT why I come to this particular forum.
I come here for audio, and audio alone. I suggest that if you wish to carry
on OT posts (some of which aren't even marked as such, such as this one)
that you go start another newsgroup like rec.audio.political.discussions or
some such, and post a link to it here. That way, the people who DO want to
discuss those things can do so, and it will actually be ON TOPIC, unlike it
is here. Then, for those of us who don't wish to read off topic stuff won't
have to wade through the preponderance of OT posts where it is clearly
against the charter (as has been pointed out numerous times), and avoid the
flame-fests which benefit nobody, and turn audio professional against audio
professional. There are a number of people here who I have a lesser respect
for than if I had never heard (metaphorically speaking) them getting into
pointless flame wars over stuff that isn't supposed to be here in the first
place. Yes, I can understand wanting to discuss things like this, but it
does not belong here. Create somepace where it will be more apropos, and the
people who are interested will join you there.

If I knew you were a strict Vegan, and visited a Vegan meeting with you, how
appreciative would the group be if I stood up and began recounting how much
I like beef, and grilling pork? It would be out of place, would it not?
Therefore, I wouldn't do that, out of courtesy to the group at large. Now,
if it were a meeting of Beeflovers International, well those comments would
be appropriate.
This is a group of audio people, and yes, they have definite political
views. But, with certain exceptions, they don't usually discuss them unless
"goaded" into it, or inflamed by someone else's differing viewpoint.

As far as people marching off, yes, I've noticed that some of our members
here have gone away, remarking how it was a pity that this forum had to go
down the toilet as well. If we ALL try, we can change that. It would
require that certain persons refrained from starting OT posts in the first
place. Maybe we could try that for a while?

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall






--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio

"Kendall" wrote in message
om...

Kendall

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall





I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to
America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy
any only by voicing our concerns can we begin the massive duty of public
awareness that will be needed to effect a change from a warrior
president and staff to a peaceful president and staff
it is essential that we become the sand in the oyster
or a pearl will never be formed
this is bigger than audio
and it needs to be said
here and anywhere else people gather
George

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall



I support the request to confine our comments to the topic of the newsgroup.

All of you who contribute your knowledge and expertise on audio.pro, I applaude
you and thank you for sharing same.

All of you who have the notion that I or anyone else is the least bit
interested in your political opinions are living in denial. If your ego is so
large that you believe you have something important to say that will change or
impact other people's view, you really do need to mature. If I need or seek
political advice, it certainly would not be on a newgroup designed for audio.

Your opinions aren't any more right or wrong than mine, therefore do not effect
change. Speak from an area of proven expertise and people will listen.

Once you guys get off topic, I cease to read what you submit. It's boring,
redundant, and takes up bandwidth.

Still adding to my killfile, relunctantly.


--Wayne

-"sounded good to me"-

I support the request to confine our comments to the topic of the newsgroup.
All of you who contribute your knowledge and expertise on audio.pro, I applaude
you and thank you for sharing same.

Yeah, agreed, but...

All of you who have the notion that I or anyone else is the least bit
interested in your political opinions are living in denial. If your ego is so
large that you believe you have something important to say that will change or
impact other people's view, you really do need to mature.

I think that's a major misconception of why people post political topics here.
Audio people think about a lot more than just audio & obviously the current
political situation has a lot of people very concerned. That doesn't indicate
ego, it doesn't show immaturity, it doesn't mean anybody is trying to change
your view to theirs. It means they need to talk to somebody, & they feel this
group comprises a set of virtual friends.

Your opinions aren't any more right or wrong than mine, therefore do not
effect
change. Speak from an area of proven expertise and people will listen.

This here is a bunch of audio folk standing around the cooler. We're supposed
to mainly talk audio but other stuff does come into the conversation. You
needn't take offense at that, it's just what happens during conversation, the
subject wanders. Tune out when you're bored, gently nudge things back to the
topic, but telling people they can't discuss what's on their minds is just
going to fuel unnecessary anger. I'd say skip that which doesn't interest you.

Once you guys get off topic, I cease to read what you submit. It's boring,
redundant, and takes up bandwidth. Still adding to my killfile, relunctantly.

I probably read only 10 per cent of what's posted anymore. I'd prefer more
audio being discussed but I'm cool with people bringing out whatever's gotten
under their collar also. Just chill & participate in that which interests you,
ignore the rest. Your blood pressure doesn't need to get worked up about any of
this, it's only an internet newsgroup, nothing more.




Scott Fraser

I support the request to confine our comments to the topic of the newsgroup.
All of you who contribute your knowledge and expertise on audio.pro, I applaude
you and thank you for sharing same.

Yeah, agreed, but...

All of you who have the notion that I or anyone else is the least bit
interested in your political opinions are living in denial. If your ego is so
large that you believe you have something important to say that will change or
impact other people's view, you really do need to mature.

I think that's a major misconception of why people post political topics here.
Audio people think about a lot more than just audio & obviously the current
political situation has a lot of people very concerned. That doesn't indicate
ego, it doesn't show immaturity, it doesn't mean anybody is trying to change
your view to theirs. It means they need to talk to somebody, & they feel this
group comprises a set of virtual friends.

Your opinions aren't any more right or wrong than mine, therefore do not
effect
change. Speak from an area of proven expertise and people will listen.

This here is a bunch of audio folk standing around the cooler. We're supposed
to mainly talk audio but other stuff does come into the conversation. You
needn't take offense at that, it's just what happens during conversation, the
subject wanders. Tune out when you're bored, gently nudge things back to the
topic, but telling people they can't discuss what's on their minds is just
going to fuel unnecessary anger. I'd say skip that which doesn't interest you.

Once you guys get off topic, I cease to read what you submit. It's boring,
redundant, and takes up bandwidth. Still adding to my killfile, relunctantly.

I probably read only 10 per cent of what's posted anymore. I'd prefer more
audio being discussed but I'm cool with people bringing out whatever's gotten
under their collar also. Just chill & participate in that which interests you,
ignore the rest. Your blood pressure doesn't need to get worked up about any of
this, it's only an internet newsgroup, nothing more.




Scott Fraser

Wayne wrote:

Still adding to my killfile, relunctantly.

Have at it. That's why they invented killfiles in the first place.

Wayne wrote:

Still adding to my killfile, relunctantly.

Have at it. That's why they invented killfiles in the first place.

From: George

I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything? Take a
lesson from your own writings.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything?

It's like bumper stickers..the only one gaining is the guy selling the
stickers.


John A. Chiara
SOS Recording Studio
Live Sound Inc.
Albany, NY
www.sosrecording.net
518-449-1637

On Sun, 5 Sep 2004 12:39:29 -0400, John wrote
(in article ):

From: George

I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything? Take a
lesson from your own writings.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

And while you're at it George, pitch in with Bob so he stops complaining
about not having what it takes to start your own newsgroup. Then you can talk
about whatever you want.

Ty Ford



-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at www.tyford.com

In article ,
(John) wrote:

From: George

I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything? Take a
lesson from your own writings.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

I have often reconsidered what i believed as true, and changed my
position. I used to be catholic, now I am not
even years of ignorant head in the sand indoctrination can become
enlightened
It does work
and If GW doesn't scare the jimminies out of you , you just arn't paying
attention
George

John wrote:

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.

I hope against hope that there is a signifigantly large
third group that is a whole lot less vocal and who are less
convinced in these matters than those of us who choose to
speak out. It is those people that I attempt to reach when
I engage in discussion of the issues or put others so
engaged in a critical light.

There is really a whole lot at stake now and the charter of
a group written in _much_ different times does not negate
the fact that there are now 84 nuclear suitcase bombs
missing from the inventory of the former USSR.


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything?

It's like bumper stickers..the only one gaining is the guy selling the
stickers.


John A. Chiara
SOS Recording Studio
Live Sound Inc.
Albany, NY
www.sosrecording.net
518-449-1637

On Sun, 5 Sep 2004 12:39:29 -0400, John wrote
(in article ):

From: George

I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything? Take a
lesson from your own writings.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

And while you're at it George, pitch in with Bob so he stops complaining
about not having what it takes to start your own newsgroup. Then you can talk
about whatever you want.

Ty Ford



-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at www.tyford.com

In article ,
(John) wrote:

From: George

I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything? Take a
lesson from your own writings.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

I have often reconsidered what i believed as true, and changed my
position. I used to be catholic, now I am not
even years of ignorant head in the sand indoctrination can become
enlightened
It does work
and If GW doesn't scare the jimminies out of you , you just arn't paying
attention
George

John wrote:

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.

I hope against hope that there is a signifigantly large
third group that is a whole lot less vocal and who are less
convinced in these matters than those of us who choose to
speak out. It is those people that I attempt to reach when
I engage in discussion of the issues or put others so
engaged in a critical light.

There is really a whole lot at stake now and the charter of
a group written in _much_ different times does not negate
the fact that there are now 84 nuclear suitcase bombs
missing from the inventory of the former USSR.


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall



I support the request to confine our comments to the topic of the newsgroup.

All of you who contribute your knowledge and expertise on audio.pro, I applaude
you and thank you for sharing same.

All of you who have the notion that I or anyone else is the least bit
interested in your political opinions are living in denial. If your ego is so
large that you believe you have something important to say that will change or
impact other people's view, you really do need to mature. If I need or seek
political advice, it certainly would not be on a newgroup designed for audio.

Your opinions aren't any more right or wrong than mine, therefore do not effect
change. Speak from an area of proven expertise and people will listen.

Once you guys get off topic, I cease to read what you submit. It's boring,
redundant, and takes up bandwidth.

Still adding to my killfile, relunctantly.


--Wayne

-"sounded good to me"-

From: George

I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to

What is wrong with you? The people who share your viewpoint don't need
convincing. Those who disagree, well, you're only serving to **** them off.
Does fanatical, belligerant behaviour really accomplish anything? Take a
lesson from your own writings.

-John Vice
www.summertimestudios.com

only by voicing our concerns can we begin the massive duty of public
awareness that will be needed to effect a change from a warrior
president and staff to a peaceful president and staff

Worked good in England before Churchill.




John A. Chiara
SOS Recording Studio
Live Sound Inc.
Albany, NY
www.sosrecording.net
518-449-1637

only by voicing our concerns can we begin the massive duty of public
awareness that will be needed to effect a change from a warrior
president and staff to a peaceful president and staff

Worked good in England before Churchill.




John A. Chiara
SOS Recording Studio
Live Sound Inc.
Albany, NY
www.sosrecording.net
518-449-1637

George wrote:

America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Terrorist are wrong. They are not freedom fighters, Revolutionary Hero's or
any other euphemism people have dreamed up to excuse the horrific behavior.
Stop defending them.

--
Nathan

"Imagine if there were no Hypothetical Situations"

Nathan West wrote:

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Ture. But Bush has created a climate for them to rally against us. More
than ever.

In article ,
Nathan West wrote:

George wrote:

America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Terrorist are wrong. They are not freedom fighters, Revolutionary Hero's or
any other euphemism people have dreamed up to excuse the horrific behavior.
Stop defending them.

--
Nathan

"Imagine if there were no Hypothetical Situations"



Dear hate moner
I ndid not sat America created EVERY terroist, just that our policy of
demanding other countries to bow and suck american dick (or bush) is
creating "lots" of terroists(as america defines them)
if one wants to stop terrosim first they should stop acting as terroists
George

Correction: America DID create, in your words, some of the "screwed up
minds that decided brutally killing people is a good policy to follow
for the whole world".

Terrorism in your case is just a matter of semantics. If a country has
a military, does that somehow make it's killing of women and children
more legitimate? Arafat is a democratically elected leader, as is
Aslan Mashkadov. Why are their soldiers labeled "terrorists"? Because
they lack a significant financial backing?


Nathan West wrote in message ...
George wrote:

America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Terrorist are wrong. They are not freedom fighters, Revolutionary Hero's or
any other euphemism people have dreamed up to excuse the horrific behavior.
Stop defending them.

Nathan West wrote:

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Ture. But Bush has created a climate for them to rally against us. More
than ever.

In article ,
Nathan West wrote:

George wrote:

America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Terrorist are wrong. They are not freedom fighters, Revolutionary Hero's or
any other euphemism people have dreamed up to excuse the horrific behavior.
Stop defending them.

--
Nathan

"Imagine if there were no Hypothetical Situations"



Dear hate moner
I ndid not sat America created EVERY terroist, just that our policy of
demanding other countries to bow and suck american dick (or bush) is
creating "lots" of terroists(as america defines them)
if one wants to stop terrosim first they should stop acting as terroists
George

Correction: America DID create, in your words, some of the "screwed up
minds that decided brutally killing people is a good policy to follow
for the whole world".

Terrorism in your case is just a matter of semantics. If a country has
a military, does that somehow make it's killing of women and children
more legitimate? Arafat is a democratically elected leader, as is
Aslan Mashkadov. Why are their soldiers labeled "terrorists"? Because
they lack a significant financial backing?


Nathan West wrote in message ...
George wrote:

America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Terrorist are wrong. They are not freedom fighters, Revolutionary Hero's or
any other euphemism people have dreamed up to excuse the horrific behavior.
Stop defending them.

George wrote:

America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy

America Didn't create screwed up minds that decided brutally killing people
is a good policy to follow for the whole world. That is a by product of
people operating at the base emotional levels of life unwilling or unable to
advance beyond it.

Terrorist are wrong. They are not freedom fighters, Revolutionary Hero's or
any other euphemism people have dreamed up to excuse the horrific behavior.
Stop defending them.

--
Nathan

"Imagine if there were no Hypothetical Situations"

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall





I absolutly belongs here, and in the food newsgroups and in the car
newsgroups, it belongs anywhere one can find anyone to tell it to
America is doing great evil
America is creating terroists with it policy
any only by voicing our concerns can we begin the massive duty of public
awareness that will be needed to effect a change from a warrior
president and staff to a peaceful president and staff
it is essential that we become the sand in the oyster
or a pearl will never be formed
this is bigger than audio
and it needs to be said
here and anywhere else people gather
George

"Kendall" wrote in message .com...
Now, that we have all that in context, let me state that I did not read most
of your original post, once I realized it didn't relate to audio. I did,
however catch your final question, and I replied with my question. In your
answer here, I can see that yes, from a certain standpoint you do have some
relevant points. However, that is NOT why I come to this particular forum.
I come here for audio, and audio alone. I suggest that if you wish to carry
on OT posts (some of which aren't even marked as such, such as this one)
that you go start another newsgroup like rec.audio.political.discussions or
some such, and post a link to it here. That way, the people who DO want to
discuss those things can do so, and it will actually be ON TOPIC, unlike it
is here. Then, for those of us who don't wish to read off topic stuff won't
have to wade through the preponderance of OT posts where it is clearly
against the charter (as has been pointed out numerous times), and avoid the
flame-fests which benefit nobody, and turn audio professional against audio
professional. There are a number of people here who I have a lesser respect
for than if I had never heard (metaphorically speaking) them getting into
pointless flame wars over stuff that isn't supposed to be here in the first
place. Yes, I can understand wanting to discuss things like this, but it
does not belong here. Create somepace where it will be more apropos, and the
people who are interested will join you there.

If I knew you were a strict Vegan, and visited a Vegan meeting with you, how
appreciative would the group be if I stood up and began recounting how much
I like beef, and grilling pork? It would be out of place, would it not?
Therefore, I wouldn't do that, out of courtesy to the group at large. Now,
if it were a meeting of Beeflovers International, well those comments would
be appropriate.
This is a group of audio people, and yes, they have definite political
views. But, with certain exceptions, they don't usually discuss them unless
"goaded" into it, or inflamed by someone else's differing viewpoint.

As far as people marching off, yes, I've noticed that some of our members
here have gone away, remarking how it was a pity that this forum had to go
down the toilet as well. If we ALL try, we can change that. It would
require that certain persons refrained from starting OT posts in the first
place. Maybe we could try that for a while?

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall

Kendall,
While I certainly agree with you that some topics do not belong on
this group I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for things to change. At
this point even when people _do_ stick to a strictly audio topic you
can expect someone like Phil Allison to show up and start attacking
people with assinine name calling and childish outbursts. Now I can
hardly tolerate reading the _audio_ threads because they contain
nearly as many bitter, venomous sentiments as the political threads
seem to inspire. There are way too many ****ed off people with too
little self-control on this group lately. :-(

ThePaulThomas wrote:

There are way too many ****ed off people with too
little self-control on this group lately. :-(

It ain't just this group. Welcome to Bush's 21st century.

ThePaulThomas wrote:

There are way too many ****ed off people with too
little self-control on this group lately. :-(

It ain't just this group. Welcome to Bush's 21st century.

On Sat, 4 Sep 2004 23:49:09 -0400, Kendall wrote
(in article ):

As far as people marching off, yes, I've noticed that some of our members
here have gone away, remarking how it was a pity that this forum had to go
down the toilet as well. If we ALL try, we can change that. It would
require that certain persons refrained from starting OT posts in the first
place. Maybe we could try that for a while?

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my opinion

about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall

Kendall, et al,

I couldn't agree more.

Regards,

Ty Ford



-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at www.tyford.com

"Kendall" wrote in message .com...
Now, that we have all that in context, let me state that I did not read most
of your original post, once I realized it didn't relate to audio. I did,
however catch your final question, and I replied with my question. In your
answer here, I can see that yes, from a certain standpoint you do have some
relevant points. However, that is NOT why I come to this particular forum.
I come here for audio, and audio alone. I suggest that if you wish to carry
on OT posts (some of which aren't even marked as such, such as this one)
that you go start another newsgroup like rec.audio.political.discussions or
some such, and post a link to it here. That way, the people who DO want to
discuss those things can do so, and it will actually be ON TOPIC, unlike it
is here. Then, for those of us who don't wish to read off topic stuff won't
have to wade through the preponderance of OT posts where it is clearly
against the charter (as has been pointed out numerous times), and avoid the
flame-fests which benefit nobody, and turn audio professional against audio
professional. There are a number of people here who I have a lesser respect
for than if I had never heard (metaphorically speaking) them getting into
pointless flame wars over stuff that isn't supposed to be here in the first
place. Yes, I can understand wanting to discuss things like this, but it
does not belong here. Create somepace where it will be more apropos, and the
people who are interested will join you there.

If I knew you were a strict Vegan, and visited a Vegan meeting with you, how
appreciative would the group be if I stood up and began recounting how much
I like beef, and grilling pork? It would be out of place, would it not?
Therefore, I wouldn't do that, out of courtesy to the group at large. Now,
if it were a meeting of Beeflovers International, well those comments would
be appropriate.
This is a group of audio people, and yes, they have definite political
views. But, with certain exceptions, they don't usually discuss them unless
"goaded" into it, or inflamed by someone else's differing viewpoint.

As far as people marching off, yes, I've noticed that some of our members
here have gone away, remarking how it was a pity that this forum had to go
down the toilet as well. If we ALL try, we can change that. It would
require that certain persons refrained from starting OT posts in the first
place. Maybe we could try that for a while?

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall

Kendall,
While I certainly agree with you that some topics do not belong on
this group I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for things to change. At
this point even when people _do_ stick to a strictly audio topic you
can expect someone like Phil Allison to show up and start attacking
people with assinine name calling and childish outbursts. Now I can
hardly tolerate reading the _audio_ threads because they contain
nearly as many bitter, venomous sentiments as the political threads
seem to inspire. There are way too many ****ed off people with too
little self-control on this group lately. :-(

On Sat, 4 Sep 2004 23:49:09 -0400, Kendall wrote
(in article ):

As far as people marching off, yes, I've noticed that some of our members
here have gone away, remarking how it was a pity that this forum had to go
down the toilet as well. If we ALL try, we can change that. It would
require that certain persons refrained from starting OT posts in the first
place. Maybe we could try that for a while?

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my opinion

about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall

Kendall, et al,

I couldn't agree more.

Regards,

Ty Ford



-- Ty Ford's equipment reviews, audio samples, rates and other audiocentric
stuff are at www.tyford.com

"Roger W. Norman" wrote in message
...

Here, I'll fix where you top-posted to my reply so that the context couldn't
easily be followed-

You said:

Any questions?


To which I replied:

What does this have to do with audio?

To which you re-replied:


Hey, why don't you tell me why it doesn't apply to audio or to life as a
business in the first place. Tell me how what I'm talking about doesn't
effect your business, or others.

But then I guess you have only one thought in your mind, that being that
nothing that has to do with events today has anything to do with your
business. You'd much rather find out for free whether a 4050 sounds
better
than a KSM 27 or whether 6" off the kick is better tha 5" or 7", all
without
simply applying some of the stuff you've heard here in the first place.

What it has to do with audio is that without a society that can do audio,
there will only be Telefunkens on Bush's podium and people will march off
to
wherever they march off to. And in case you didn't notice, people are
already marching off to where they march off to.

So that's what it has to do with audio.

"The saddest thing is that I didn't say anything at all."

Now, that we have all that in context, let me state that I did not read most
of your original post, once I realized it didn't relate to audio. I did,
however catch your final question, and I replied with my question. In your
answer here, I can see that yes, from a certain standpoint you do have some
relevant points. However, that is NOT why I come to this particular forum.
I come here for audio, and audio alone. I suggest that if you wish to carry
on OT posts (some of which aren't even marked as such, such as this one)
that you go start another newsgroup like rec.audio.political.discussions or
some such, and post a link to it here. That way, the people who DO want to
discuss those things can do so, and it will actually be ON TOPIC, unlike it
is here. Then, for those of us who don't wish to read off topic stuff won't
have to wade through the preponderance of OT posts where it is clearly
against the charter (as has been pointed out numerous times), and avoid the
flame-fests which benefit nobody, and turn audio professional against audio
professional. There are a number of people here who I have a lesser respect
for than if I had never heard (metaphorically speaking) them getting into
pointless flame wars over stuff that isn't supposed to be here in the first
place. Yes, I can understand wanting to discuss things like this, but it
does not belong here. Create somepace where it will be more apropos, and the
people who are interested will join you there.

If I knew you were a strict Vegan, and visited a Vegan meeting with you, how
appreciative would the group be if I stood up and began recounting how much
I like beef, and grilling pork? It would be out of place, would it not?
Therefore, I wouldn't do that, out of courtesy to the group at large. Now,
if it were a meeting of Beeflovers International, well those comments would
be appropriate.
This is a group of audio people, and yes, they have definite political
views. But, with certain exceptions, they don't usually discuss them unless
"goaded" into it, or inflamed by someone else's differing viewpoint.

As far as people marching off, yes, I've noticed that some of our members
here have gone away, remarking how it was a pity that this forum had to go
down the toilet as well. If we ALL try, we can change that. It would
require that certain persons refrained from starting OT posts in the first
place. Maybe we could try that for a while?

I repeat; It does not belong here. You have not changed that, or my
opinion about it. It does not belong here.

Kendall






--


Roger W. Norman
SirMusic Studio

"Kendall" wrote in message
om...

Kendall

Roger W. Norman wrote:
Hey, why don't you tell me why it doesn't apply to audio or to life as a
business in the first place. Tell me how what I'm talking about doesn't
effect your business, or others.

I agree, this isn't anything to do with audio. These are world events
which affect the whole world and everyone in the world to some extent.
So are other things - environmentalism would just be one example.

These threads are nearly always American-centric. Tell me, what would
you judge to have been the principle events this year in Norway? Should
rec.audio.pro be used as a forum to discuss them? America is 5% of the
worlds population.

Perhaps you should explicitly state exactly what you think RAP is for.
What is on topic, professional audio and 9/11 orientated politics?
Anything that interests you or anyone else?

Why don't you post these things into one of the politics groups? Why
have an hierarchy in Usenet if any group can be used to post threads on
any topic? I'm sure a lot of people come onto these groups to get away
from world events. I don't think that you could claim that these
political topics are not being raised in other forums and other mediums.

Sorry if I seem to getting at you but people not obeying the Usenet
hierarchy is a pet hate of mine. Maybe you could participate in the
political threads in other channels and place a pointer to the
discussion in this group? Then you could have the opinions of other
audio professionals.

--
***My real address is m/ike at u/nmusic d/ot co dot u/k (removing /s)
np:
http://www.unmusic.co.uk
http://www.unmusic.co.uk/Top_50_Films.html - favorite films
http://www.unmusic.co.uk/amh-s.html - alt.music.home-studio

killermike wrote:


Why don't you post these things into one of the politics groups?

Scott Fraser summarized the reason we do it here in an
earlier post.

Mike, if you are tired of hearing this just tell me to
bugger off, but you, among us, are the only one who knows
the ropes for setting up a new usenet group from the
exellent job you did with the h-s group. You would be a
real hero to a lot of people if you could turn that
expertise toward the establishment of a rec.audio.pro.saloon
group where these discussions could be partitioned but would
likely have the same participants.


Bob
--

"Things should be described as simply as possible, but no
simpler."

A. Einstein