[Joe[_13_]]

I have two projects that I am trying to wrap up here. Both require
adding a few two part vocal harmonies on a few songs, but the artists
are not available to travel to Maui for a while to record the harmonies.
Both are OK with artificial harmonies (i.e.harmonizer) if they sound good.

I am thinking of buying a harmonizer and my question is which one? The
music on both projects is pretty mellow Hawaiian. Backing tracks
include some combination of 6 and 12 string guitar, ukulele, and steel
guitar.

I have considered TC Helicons Voiceworks or Voiceworks Plus or maybe an
older Voice Prism and a few others.

Do I really need to go to Eventide to get a reasonably natural sounding
two part harmony sound. If so, do they have a lower cost model that
would produce good harmonies but maybe without so many bells and
whistles. In terms of the Harmonizer Function, does Eventide still rule
enough to justify the cost?

Any other I should be looking at. Budget is $1000 tops, but prefer
$400-$600.
Aloha
Joe in Maui
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

[Joe[_13_]]

OOops, sorry no title on first post


Joe wrote:
I have two projects that I am trying to wrap up here. Both require
adding a few two part vocal harmonies on a few songs, but the artists
are not available to travel to Maui for a while to record the harmonies.
Both are OK with artificial harmonies (i.e.harmonizer) if they sound good.

I am thinking of buying a harmonizer and my question is which one? The
music on both projects is pretty mellow Hawaiian. Backing tracks
include some combination of 6 and 12 string guitar, ukulele, and steel
guitar.

I have considered TC Helicons Voiceworks or Voiceworks Plus or maybe an
older Voice Prism and a few others.

Do I really need to go to Eventide to get a reasonably natural sounding
two part harmony sound. If so, do they have a lower cost model that
would produce good harmonies but maybe without so many bells and
whistles. In terms of the Harmonizer Function, does Eventide still rule
enough to justify the cost?

Any other I should be looking at. Budget is $1000 tops, but prefer
$400-$600.
Aloha
Joe in Maui
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

[polymod]

"Joe" wrote in message
...
I have two projects that I am trying to wrap up here. Both require
adding a few two part vocal harmonies on a few songs, but the artists
are not available to travel to Maui for a while to record the harmonies.
Both are OK with artificial harmonies (i.e.harmonizer) if they sound good.

I am thinking of buying a harmonizer and my question is which one? The
music on both projects is pretty mellow Hawaiian. Backing tracks
include some combination of 6 and 12 string guitar, ukulele, and steel
guitar.

I have considered TC Helicons Voiceworks or Voiceworks Plus or maybe an
older Voice Prism and a few others.

Do I really need to go to Eventide to get a reasonably natural sounding
two part harmony sound. If so, do they have a lower cost model that
would produce good harmonies but maybe without so many bells and
whistles. In terms of the Harmonizer Function, does Eventide still rule
enough to justify the cost?

Any other I should be looking at. Budget is $1000 tops, but prefer
$400-$600.
Aloha
Joe in Maui

Hi Joe.
I can't help you with the harmonizer thing, but by chance do these "artists"
have any recording software to do it themselves, and send the wav files back
to you?

Just a thought.

Poly

[Joe[_13_]]

polymod wrote:


Hi Joe.
I can't help you with the harmonizer thing, but by chance do these "artists"
have any recording software to do it themselves, and send the wav files back
to you?

Just a thought.

Poly



Aloha
Well both artists are very talented, but are not professional musicians.
They might have access to recording software but wouldn't have the
knowledge to use it correctly nor the support hardware. Each could get
access to a studio on their island, but they have developed a trust and
high comfort level at my studio (home based and very relaxing) and don't
want to record anywhere else. Good idea though, but I don't think we can
make that work in either case.
Aloha
Joe
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

[Scott Dorsey]

Joe wrote:
I have two projects that I am trying to wrap up here. Both require
adding a few two part vocal harmonies on a few songs, but the artists
are not available to travel to Maui for a while to record the harmonies.
Both are OK with artificial harmonies (i.e.harmonizer) if they sound good.

The thing is, the harmonizer doesn't sound like the real thing. It's a
fun effect, and maybe it's the effect that will be good for the song,
but it's not like a real vocal harmony.

My first thought in your case is why can't you send tapes (or disks) out
to the performers, have them lay down tracks locally and then send them
back to you to fly in the new parts?

I am thinking of buying a harmonizer and my question is which one? The
music on both projects is pretty mellow Hawaiian. Backing tracks
include some combination of 6 and 12 string guitar, ukulele, and steel
guitar.

That would tend to make me think more toward having a real live vocal
part.

I have considered TC Helicons Voiceworks or Voiceworks Plus or maybe an
older Voice Prism and a few others.

Do I really need to go to Eventide to get a reasonably natural sounding
two part harmony sound. If so, do they have a lower cost model that
would produce good harmonies but maybe without so many bells and
whistles. In terms of the Harmonizer Function, does Eventide still rule
enough to justify the cost?

The Eventide still isn't really very natural sounding, but it's better
than most and it's the easiest one to rent. I am very surprised you
can't call a rental house in Honolulu and get one for the weekend. Worst
case you should be able to get one from California.

The Voiceworks is a fun effect.... it's still not very natural and there
is no way it won't be noticed as being an effect, but it is still a useful
effect. I think I'd consider all of these boxes like that.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Phil W]

Scott Dorsey wrote:

The Eventide still isn't really very natural sounding, but it's better
than most and it's the easiest one to rent.

Is it still like that? I remember hearing a mix with Eventide H3000 (at
least I think, it was that model) about 10 years ago. Well, it was for an
"industrial" band, so they may have been after a kind of "artificial" sound
character from the harmonizer, but I didn´t really like the sound - it was
very unnatural to my ears.

The Voiceworks is a fun effect.... it's still not very natural and
there is no way it won't be noticed as being an effect, but it is
still a useful effect. I think I'd consider all of these boxes like
that.

The Voiceworks, I´ve only heard on a demo audio CD from TC. They sounded
still like an audible effect, but somehow more pleasant than what I heard
from Eventide harmonizers.

But I wouldn´t call myself a professional audio guy, rather a musician with
an interest in recording etc. - so I´m interested in what experienced pro
audio folks have to say about such devices. Maybe, there´s also a software
effect of good quality?
Anyway, I´ve already learned from (somewhat limited) experience, that it
definitely sounds better to record natural harmony vocals of the same
person, than trying to "synthesize" additional voices. The same way, as it
sounds better to have good individual performances of each chorus parts,
rather than just looking for the best performance and then copying this one
to all chorus parts in the song. Technically, this is not a big issue with
modern DAW software, but soundwise it can make a huge difference. IMHO, more
natural sounding is usually preferrable - this may be different with certain
genres (e.g. "industrial" or some kind of "electronic music"), where rather
"artificial sounding" voices rather fit the overall artificial character of
the music. Personally, I mostly deal with several kinds of rock stuff (from
mainstream to hardcore punk) - typical "handmade music" stuff...


Sorry, for potentially being OT. I don´t use harmonizer effects, but I
always like to learn more about stuff from the experiences of professionals
like in this group.
You guys have already helped me understand a lot of things throughout
several years now - thanks a lot for that!


Phil

[Federico]

Why don't you play around with Melodyne?
F.

[Scott Dorsey]

Phil W wrote:
Scott Dorsey wrote:

The Eventide still isn't really very natural sounding, but it's better
than most and it's the easiest one to rent.

Is it still like that? I remember hearing a mix with Eventide H3000 (at
least I think, it was that model) about 10 years ago. Well, it was for an
"industrial" band, so they may have been after a kind of "artificial" sound
character from the harmonizer, but I didn´t really like the sound - it was
very unnatural to my ears.

That's what it's for! You can get a variety of different effects from it
and they are all interesting and useful for something, but none of them sound
like several real people singing together.

The Voiceworks is a fun effect.... it's still not very natural and
there is no way it won't be noticed as being an effect, but it is
still a useful effect. I think I'd consider all of these boxes like
that.

The Voiceworks, I´ve only heard on a demo audio CD from TC. They sounded
still like an audible effect, but somehow more pleasant than what I heard
from Eventide harmonizers.

I think the Eventide can do similar things now, but yes, they are all more
or less in the same general league.

But I wouldn´t call myself a professional audio guy, rather a musician with
an interest in recording etc. - so I´m interested in what experienced pro
audio folks have to say about such devices. Maybe, there´s also a software
effect of good quality?

They are fun effects, and sometimes you want a fun effect. But if you want
real vocals, you need to have real vocals. Sometimes you don't want real
vocals in pop music, though.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Romeo Rondeau[_4_]]

But I wouldn´t call myself a professional audio guy, rather a musician with
an interest in recording etc. - so I´m interested in what experienced pro
audio folks have to say about such devices. Maybe, there´s also a software
effect of good quality?

They are fun effects, and sometimes you want a fun effect. But if you want
real vocals, you need to have real vocals. Sometimes you don't want real
vocals in pop music, though.
--scott

****, in pop today, they are just gonna autotune the "real" right out of
the vocals anyway :-) In the 80's we tried to make a harmonizer sound
like real vocals, now we try to make real vocals sound like a harmonizer!

[WillStG]

On Oct 31, 7:02*pm, Joe wrote:
I have two projects that I am trying to wrap up here. Both require
adding a few two part vocal harmonies *on a few songs, but the artists
are not available to travel to Maui for a while to record the harmonies.
Both are OK with artificial harmonies (i.e.harmonizer) if they sound good..

I am thinking of buying a harmonizer and my question is which one? The
music on both projects *is pretty mellow Hawaiian. Backing tracks
include some combination of 6 and 12 string guitar, ukulele, and steel
guitar.

I have considered TC Helicons Voiceworks or Voiceworks Plus or maybe an
older Voice Prism and a few others.

Do I really need to go to Eventide to get a reasonably natural sounding
two part harmony sound. If so, do they have *a lower cost model *that
would produce good harmonies but maybe without so many bells and
whistles. In terms of the Harmonizer Function, does Eventide still rule
enough to justify the cost?

Any other I should be looking at. Budget is $1000 tops, but prefer
$400-$600.
Aloha
Joe in Maui

Just find a good local singer to record the parts. Lots of
talented Hawaiian singers who will do a cash date session, for less
than the cost of a Harmonizer, and it'll sound better.

Will Miho
NY TV/Audio Post/Music/Lie Sound Guy
"The large print giveth and the small print taketh away..." Tom Waits