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#1
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Advice needed...sub/tweeter phasing, etc.
I've been lurking this group for a while, and am by no means an expert audio
person; please keep that in mind if my questions seem a bit naive. I have a 97 Mazda MX-6. Focal 165K in front, stock 5X7 in rear, 2 12" RF DVC subs in prefab 1.25 cu. sealed enclosures. My initial impression was that the bass was muddy (in layman's terms I couldn't 'imagine' the bass pedal hitting the kick drum). I initially thought this was a midbass problem, since I hadn't dynamatted the doors. I played around with the Head Unit's parametric EQ and discovered that it wasn't a midbass problem...if I boosted at the crossover frequency (3.5 khz) I had the snap back and it sounded 'better'. Keep in mind I brought much of this on myself, as the mids are in the door and the tweeters are on top of the dash. (I didn't want to mess with building custom kickpanels for the focals, maybe another day.) Anyway, I discovered that if I reverse the phase of the tweeter and Subs, leaving the mids alone, I don't need to have the 6db boost at the crossover frequency, and the pedal hits are still crisp. Undoubtedly the separation between mids and tweeter was causing considerable cancellation. I'm not sure, however, how this has effected the high end. The tweeters are still fairly smooth, I just think they are perhaps a bit less defined? less 'up front'? I could be imagining this as a result of the improved upper midrange response. I know many people have experimented with sub box placement and positioning, and done testing, etc. Is there any comparable info on tweet/mid phasing and it's consequences? Would I get the same result if I 'un' phased the tweets and mids and just reversed the phase on the mids? Thanks for any responses, Rich |
#2
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The reason you don't hear people as concerned about phasing issue involving
tweeters is that high frequency sounds are very directional and generally the sound from your tweeters reach your ears before interference with the other tweeter can occur. With lower frequencies this is not the case. Bass goes EVERYWHERE and considerable cancellation can occur before the sound reaches your ears. Of course, cancellation CAN occur with high frequencies and should not be ignored. But in your case, focus first on low frequency cancellation issues. Hope this helps. MOSFET "Richard G. Pecoraro" wrote in message ... I've been lurking this group for a while, and am by no means an expert audio person; please keep that in mind if my questions seem a bit naive. I have a 97 Mazda MX-6. Focal 165K in front, stock 5X7 in rear, 2 12" RF DVC subs in prefab 1.25 cu. sealed enclosures. My initial impression was that the bass was muddy (in layman's terms I couldn't 'imagine' the bass pedal hitting the kick drum). I initially thought this was a midbass problem, since I hadn't dynamatted the doors. I played around with the Head Unit's parametric EQ and discovered that it wasn't a midbass problem...if I boosted at the crossover frequency (3.5 khz) I had the snap back and it sounded 'better'. Keep in mind I brought much of this on myself, as the mids are in the door and the tweeters are on top of the dash. (I didn't want to mess with building custom kickpanels for the focals, maybe another day.) Anyway, I discovered that if I reverse the phase of the tweeter and Subs, leaving the mids alone, I don't need to have the 6db boost at the crossover frequency, and the pedal hits are still crisp. Undoubtedly the separation between mids and tweeter was causing considerable cancellation. I'm not sure, however, how this has effected the high end. The tweeters are still fairly smooth, I just think they are perhaps a bit less defined? less 'up front'? I could be imagining this as a result of the improved upper midrange response. I know many people have experimented with sub box placement and positioning, and done testing, etc. Is there any comparable info on tweet/mid phasing and it's consequences? Would I get the same result if I 'un' phased the tweets and mids and just reversed the phase on the mids? Thanks for any responses, Rich |
#3
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Ditto what MOSFET said. When it comes to phase, it's not the tweeter's
interaction per se, but the interaction between the tweeter and midrange speaker. In fact, most component sets already have the tweeters wired out of phase, mostly to account for the phase shift caused by the crossover. So what I suspect you're doing is adjusting the relative phase between the midrange and tweeter. Play around with it until it's where you like it. And yes, aiming is crucial. Perhaps even more crucial than the quality of the tweeter itself! Note also that "directly pointed at you" is not always best. Try 20-30 degrees off axis, or even bouncing off the windshield. No one said it was easy. You could spend months tweaking... "Richard G. Pecoraro" wrote in message ... I've been lurking this group for a while, and am by no means an expert audio person; please keep that in mind if my questions seem a bit naive. I have a 97 Mazda MX-6. Focal 165K in front, stock 5X7 in rear, 2 12" RF DVC subs in prefab 1.25 cu. sealed enclosures. My initial impression was that the bass was muddy (in layman's terms I couldn't 'imagine' the bass pedal hitting the kick drum). I initially thought this was a midbass problem, since I hadn't dynamatted the doors. I played around with the Head Unit's parametric EQ and discovered that it wasn't a midbass problem...if I boosted at the crossover frequency (3.5 khz) I had the snap back and it sounded 'better'. Keep in mind I brought much of this on myself, as the mids are in the door and the tweeters are on top of the dash. (I didn't want to mess with building custom kickpanels for the focals, maybe another day.) Anyway, I discovered that if I reverse the phase of the tweeter and Subs, leaving the mids alone, I don't need to have the 6db boost at the crossover frequency, and the pedal hits are still crisp. Undoubtedly the separation between mids and tweeter was causing considerable cancellation. I'm not sure, however, how this has effected the high end. The tweeters are still fairly smooth, I just think they are perhaps a bit less defined? less 'up front'? I could be imagining this as a result of the improved upper midrange response. I know many people have experimented with sub box placement and positioning, and done testing, etc. Is there any comparable info on tweet/mid phasing and it's consequences? Would I get the same result if I 'un' phased the tweets and mids and just reversed the phase on the mids? Thanks for any responses, Rich |
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