[ChrisCoaster]

It should be federal law that every house and home have at least one
serious set of cans. In my case they are the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro.
I have received nothing but pleasure from listening to anything I've
plugged this model into and any style of music or even movie audio.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can say I "pretty-
much" know what a quality headphone is supposed to sound like.

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth the
investment and will I notice any difference between it and the 280?

I ask this assuming that at least one or two folks on here have
experienced Sennheiser products.

Thanks for your input,

-ChrisCoaster
"If you scream on roller-coasters you're missing the ride!!"

[William Sommerwerck]

Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

I own STAX Lambda Pro 'phones and the SRM-T1 amplifier. They're better than
the Sennheisers, but not exactly cheap.

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 29, 9:16*pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

I own STAX Lambda Pro 'phones and the SRM-T1 amplifier. They're better than
the Sennheisers, but not exactly cheap.
___________
Cannot find that on their site.

Pretty much the 380 has a slightly lower impedence, slightly higher
max SPL, and a higher high-end frequency response - which will be lost
on me(!). Also, the pressure exerted on the head is slightly more(?)
- 6n vs 4n for the 280s. Whatever that value means. They both isolate
acoustically to almost the same degree, both have replaceable parts
(cord & ear pieces), and you can walk around a room freely with
either.

-CC

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 29, 9:16*pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

I own STAX Lambda Pro 'phones and the SRM-T1 amplifier. They're better than
the Sennheisers, but not exactly cheap.
___________
Cannot the 580 on their site. Discontinued?

Pretty much the 380 has a slightly lower impedence, slightly higher
max SPL, and a higher high-end frequency response - which will be
lost
on me(!). Also, the pressure exerted on the head is slightly more(?)
- 6n vs 4n for the 280s. Whatever that value means. They both
isolate
acoustically to almost the same degree, both have replaceable parts
(cord & ear pieces), and you can walk around a room freely with
either.


-CC

[Geoff]

ChrisCoaster wrote:
It should be federal law that every house and home have at least one
serious set of cans. In my case they are the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro.
I have received nothing but pleasure from listening to anything I've
plugged this model into and any style of music or even movie audio.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can say I "pretty-
much" know what a quality headphone is supposed to sound like.

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth the
investment and will I notice any difference between it and the 280?

I ask this assuming that at least one or two folks on here have
experienced Sennheiser products.

Thanks for your input,

Dunno. But apart from the great isolation, I find my HD-280s slightly blaaa
to listen to, and bloody uncomfirtable.

Try ATH-M50s and you might just be blown away.

geoff

[nebulax]

On Sep 29, 9:30*pm, ChrisCoaster wrote:
On Sep 29, 9:16*pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote: Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a bad one..

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

I own STAX Lambda Pro 'phones and the SRM-T1 amplifier. They're better than
the Sennheisers, but not exactly cheap.

___________
Cannot the 580 on their site. Discontinued?

Pretty much the 380 has a slightly lower impedence, slightly higher
max SPL, and a higher high-end frequency response - which will be
lost
on me(!). *Also, the pressure exerted on the head is slightly more(?)
- 6n vs 4n for the 280s. Whatever that value means. *They both
isolate
acoustically to almost the same degree, both have replaceable parts
(cord & ear pieces), and you can walk around a room freely with
either.

-CC


I think the Sennheiser 580 has been discontinued, but the 600 and the
650 are still available, which were basically improvements on the
original 580 design. I have a pair of 565's (cheaper than the 580's,
but also discontinued), and while I've never compared them directly to
the other Senn phones, they're still the best overall cans I've ever
owned.

-Neb

[Kompan]

On Sep 30, 4:41*am, "geoff" wrote:
ChrisCoaster wrote:
It should be federal law that every house and home have at least one
serious set of cans. *In my case they are the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro.
I have received nothing but pleasure from listening to anything I've
plugged this model into and any style of music or even movie audio.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can say I "pretty-
much" know what a quality headphone is supposed to sound like.

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth the
investment and will I notice any difference between it and the 280?

I ask this assuming that at least one or two folks on here have
experienced Sennheiser products.

Thanks for your input,

Dunno. But apart from the great isolation, I find my HD-280s slightly blaaa
to listen to, and bloody uncomfirtable.

Try ATH-M50s and you might just be blown away.

geoff

+1 for ATH-M50

[Arny Krueger]

"ChrisCoaster" wrote in message


It should be federal law that every house and home have
at least one serious set of cans.

I'm a bit too much of a Libertarian for that sort of thing! ;-)

In my case they are
the Sennheiser HD-280 Pro. I have received nothing but
pleasure from listening to anything I've plugged this
model into and any style of music or even movie audio.

I have a pair of MD-280 Pros (and most of the rest of the phones I mention
here) and they are what they are. Good value at the very least. Very tight
fitting but that means that they have good bass. Might be a bit elevated on
the top end, but in the realm of right. Good on-location recording phones
because they have pretty good isolation and decent balance. They can get
uncomfortable in extended use.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can
say I "pretty- much" know what a quality headphone is
supposed to sound like.

MDR-V6 and MDR 7506 are more comfortable, but a little lighter on the bass
for the same reason. Poor isolation if you need isolation. A tad harsher on
the high end,. Again, in the realm of right. I've worn out a pair of MDR-V6
and a pair of MDR 7506. I replaced the 7506s. Still use them on my other
music/video production PC.

MDR V600s have far more bass, tighter but still fairly comfortable seal, and
a smoother high end. Perhaps, a little light on the high end. I'm not so
sure about them - probably what many would call a "DJ headphone".

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth
the investment and will I notice any difference between
it and the 280?

The 580 used to be a reasonable step up, but they are out of production.
Sad. Nice phones at a nice price point.

The 580, 600, 650 and up are open-ear headphones with minimal isolation but
good bass. Very smooth. They have been compared favorably to Stax. I've
heard the Stax but not in a formal comparison. Again, all a bit different,
all very smooth, and all in the realm of right. Very much saltier than
280s.

Someone mentioned the ATH-M50s. Got a pair of those right here on this PC.
Very smooth, a bit light in the bass compared to say the 280s and MDR 600s,
but far more comfortable. Again, in the realm of right. A tad more expensive
than HD 280s but close if you shop around. Maybe, a logical next step up for
you. Not what I'd call good on-site recording phones due to the lack of
isolation.

Different horses for different courses. ;-)

[Scott Dorsey]

William Sommerwerck wrote:
Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a bad one.

I have. They are now making a couple lines of cheap nasty headphones for
the home market. Actually, I think they are just rebadging them. This
does not in any way degrade their regular headphones, though, just that
you should watch out.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

All the headphones in this line are good, but they all sound different, and
they all have different leakage characteristics.

I own STAX Lambda Pro 'phones and the SRM-T1 amplifier. They're better than
the Sennheisers, but not exactly cheap.

Better for a lot of things, but not much good for tracking or working in
noisy environments.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Wecan do it]

"ChrisCoaster" wrote in message
...
It should be federal law that every house and home have at
least one
serious set of cans. In my case they are the Sennheiser
HD-280 Pro.
I have received nothing but pleasure from listening to
anything I've
plugged this model into and any style of music or even movie
audio.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can say
I "pretty-
much" know what a quality headphone is supposed to sound
like.

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth
the
investment and will I notice any difference between it and
the 280?

I ask this assuming that at least one or two folks on here
have
experienced Sennheiser products.

Thanks for your input,

-ChrisCoaster
"If you scream on roller-coasters you're missing the ride!!"

Lets talk Sennheiser HD600's. Nothing to complain about the
sound, I 've worn them for hours every night for a few years
now. I hook them to the center channel on the TV so I can
understand what is being said without blasting out my wife.
Extreem comfort.

These cans were made with break away 2 prong connectons on
each can. They never worked properly, always cutting out and
driving me crazy. I had to open up the outside screen cover
and solder the wires to the little tabs they put inside there.
Now after a couple of years I just opened them up again and
had to resolder them cause where I ty-wrapped the wire to the
can the super thin wires broke and they started cutting out
again. No I am not dancing with these things on just sitting
on a couch and watching TV. The cloth covered pads are holding
up but the black foam that protects the drivers from my ears
has fallen apart and disappeared long ago. I think they are
not too durable.

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot less.

peace
dawg

[William Sommerwerck]

Lets talk Sennheiser HD600's. Nothing to complain about the
sound, I 've worn them for hours every night for a few years
now. I hook them to the center channel on the TV so I can
understand what is being said without blasting out my wife.
Extreem comfort.

These cans were made with break away 2 prong connectons on
each can. They never worked properly, always cutting out and
driving me crazy.

I solved this problem with my 580s... I said to Sennheiser "Fix it -- or
else." That was several years ago, and I've had no problems since.

In most states there is no limitation of warranty of products that are
fundamentally flawed.

[Reinhard Zwirner]

William Sommerwerck schrieb:

Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

Please don't compare apples and pears! The HD 580 and the later
mentioned HD 600/HD 650 are OPEN headphones while the HD 280 is
a closed one. Obviously this feature is important for the OP,
otherwise he wouldn't search information about the HD 380 pro:

http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser/home_en.nsf/root/professional_headphones-headsets_headphones_502717?Open&row=1

HTH

Reinhard

[Arkansan Raider]

Wecan do it wrote:

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot less.

peace
dawg



I like the AKG 240, and I own a pair of the 270s. I like the sound, as
they seem pretty flat, but I also sweat my ears off when I wear them too
long.

---Jeff

[Arny Krueger]

"William Sommerwerck" wrote in
message
Lets talk Sennheiser HD600's. Nothing to complain about
the sound, I 've worn them for hours every night for a
few years now. I hook them to the center channel on the
TV so I can understand what is being said without
blasting out my wife. Extreem comfort.

These cans were made with break away 2 prong connectons
on each can. They never worked properly, always cutting
out and driving me crazy.

I solved this problem with my 580s... I said to
Sennheiser "Fix it -- or else." That was several years
ago, and I've had no problems since.

In most states there is no limitation of warranty of
products that are fundamentally flawed.

I've heard of lots of people who had problems like this with 580s. I guess I
was either lucky, or enough of a late adopter to get the enhanced model. In
the application I used the 580s for, lots of headphones have bit the dust
completely and totally including V900s.

The 580s needed some parts replaced over the year - a cord and a headband
that someone stepped on. The Sennheiser web site allowed me to order them
and the prices were reasonable. I'd still have the 580s and use them every
day, except that someone broke into my house and stole them.

[Wecan do it]

"Reinhard Zwirner" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck schrieb:

Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a
bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or
something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

Please don't compare apples and pears! The HD 580 and the
later
mentioned HD 600/HD 650 are OPEN headphones while the HD 280
is
a closed one. Obviously this feature is important for the
OP,
otherwise he wouldn't search information about the HD 380
pro:


HTH

Reinhard

I thought we were talking about Sennheiser, not a type of can.
SORRY for making your eyes or your national pride hurt!

peace
dawg

[Reinhard Zwirner]

Wecan do it wrote:

"Reinhard Zwirner" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck wrote:

Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a
bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or
something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

Please don't compare apples and pears! The HD 580 and the
later
mentioned HD 600/HD 650 are OPEN headphones while the HD 280
is
a closed one. Obviously this feature is important for the
OP,
otherwise he wouldn't search information about the HD 380
pro: [...]

I thought we were talking about Sennheiser, not a type of can.

You're right, we were talking about Sennheiser; but we were
talking about cans, too! The OP obviously owns a HD 280 (=closed)
and asked for information about/experience with HD 380 (=closed).
In another posting he mentioned the acoustical isolation of both
headphones. My conclusion: he's interested in new headphones with
acoustical isolation.

Therefore all answers mentioning open Sennheiser headphones seemed
somehow misleading to me. Maybe I'm wrong shrug ... I just tried
to help.

SORRY for making your eyes or your national pride hurt!
?????????

Best regards

Reinhard

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 30, 1:43*pm, Reinhard Zwirner wrote:
Wecan do it wrote:

"Reinhard Zwirner" wrote in message
...
William Sommerwerck wrote:

Sennheiser makes very good headphones. I've never heard a
bad one.

If you're going to get a better headphone, go to the 580 or
something even
better. I don't think you'll regret it.

Please don't compare apples and pears! The HD 580 and the
later
mentioned HD 600/HD 650 are OPEN headphones while the HD 280
is
a closed one. Obviously this feature is important for the
OP,
otherwise he wouldn't search information about the HD 380
pro: [...]
I thought we were talking about Sennheiser, not a type of can.

You're right, we were talking about Sennheiser; but we were
talking about cans, too! The OP obviously owns a HD 280 (=closed)
and asked for information about/experience with HD 380 (=closed).
In another posting he mentioned the acoustical isolation of both
headphones. My conclusion: he's interested in new headphones with
acoustical isolation.

Therefore all answers mentioning open Sennheiser headphones seemed
somehow misleading to me. *Maybe I'm wrong shrug ... I just tried
to help.

SORRY for making your eyes or your national pride hurt!

?????????

Best regards

Reinhard- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
_______________________
You've all been great. Yes, I do prefer closed cans, and would like
to upgrade within the Sennie line if possible. The fact sheed over
at http://www.sennheiser.com/sennheiser/products.nsf/resources/8F67C484DF2CD44AC1257482003BEB49/$File/HD_280_Pro_GB.pdf
details the freq. resp. of this phone, and it pretty much corresponds
to what I hear.

When listening to music flat - no EQ - all headphones sound slightly
bass shy to me. I've been that way since birth - turn up the bass
knob!! But overall the HD-280's tone is balanced and I hear details
of songs that I would miss through lesser phones(ear buds, Sony MDR-
V300(poor man's MDR-V600!). For instance, listening to some early 70s
songs where the song builds - guitar, + vocals, +keyboards, +drums,
etc., I can actually hear the analog hiss just preceeding each track
as it's punched in! And that's on a 256kbps MP3, let alone a CD.

So I take it no one hear has had hands-on(or ears-on) experience with
the 380?

I just wish there was a site that measured and reviewed headphones in
the $100-200 price range so I could make an informed choice. I live
by a budget, so $180 or so is the most I'd spend on a headphone that
would never leave the house. I know all the "serious" brand names -
Sony, Sennheiser, AKG, Grado, Audio-Technica, Koss, etc. And just
those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me that's a brand I
should also consider. I'm just looking for objective testing to know
I'm getting one with the best combination of flat freq response,
isolation, and decent SPL when driven by anything from a wimpy Sansa
View mp3 deck up to a JVC home theater receiver.

-CC

[Geoff]

Soundhaspriority wrote:

I don't like the 280's at all. I gave mine away. Bright, thin,
unmusical. DJ phones.

None of the DJs I know are either bright or thin. But definitely unmusical,
except one maybe... !

geoff

[Geoff]

Arkansan Raider wrote:
Wecan do it wrote:

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot less.

peace
dawg



I like the AKG 240, and I own a pair of the 270s. I like the sound, as
they seem pretty flat, but I also sweat my ears off when I wear them
too long.

I have both, as well as hd280, k240, k141S, mdr-7506 and ATH-M50.

The 270s also fit the bright and thin description, and the K240s somewhat
less so. However the MK2 version seem very bright and thin.

Must be catering to those with HF loss.

The only thing I use the HD280 for is tracking vocalists. However I am happy
to use the ATs even for recreational listening, far more than the K240s.

geoff

[William Sommerwerck]

And just those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me
that's a brand I should also consider.

I reviewed many headphones at Stereophile, and AKGs were among the worst --
colored, and not particularly clean. I don't know why they're so popular.

[Arkansan Raider]

geoff wrote:
Arkansan Raider wrote:
Wecan do it wrote:

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot less.

peace
dawg


I like the AKG 240, and I own a pair of the 270s. I like the sound, as
they seem pretty flat, but I also sweat my ears off when I wear them
too long.

I have both, as well as hd280, k240, k141S, mdr-7506 and ATH-M50.

The 270s also fit the bright and thin description, and the K240s somewhat
less so. However the MK2 version seem very bright and thin.

Must be catering to those with HF loss.

The only thing I use the HD280 for is tracking vocalists.

Funny, that's what I use *my* cans for. g

However I am happy
to use the ATs even for recreational listening, far more than the K240s.

geoff


I've some in-ears that I kinda' like, but I only use them with my iPod
or my computer.

They're Shure E2c's.

---Jeff

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 30, 8:44*pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
And just those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me
that's a brand I should also consider.

I reviewed many headphones at Stereophile, and AKGs were among the worst --
colored, and not particularly clean. I don't know why they're so popular.
____________________
One theory of mine:

Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

The less perfectly flat, more colored headphones appeal to larger
groups(the "boomy bass" set or the "tinny treble" crowd).

I calibrate TV sets in my spare time for folks. They appreciate that
the picture conforms to broadcast/professional standards, but don't
particularly like the image. Complaints of the color not being bold
enough or that the picture is "too soft" abound. But crank the
contrast, color, & sharpness back up, and they're in heaven!

Thoughts on this?

-CC

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 30, 9:10*pm, Arkansan Raider wrote:
geoff wrote:
Arkansan Raider wrote:
Wecan do it wrote:

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot less.

peace
dawg

I like the AKG 240, and I own a pair of the 270s. I like the sound, as
they seem pretty flat, but I also sweat my ears off when I wear them
too long.

I have both, as well as hd280, k240, k141S, mdr-7506 and ATH-M50.

The 270s also fit the bright and thin description, and the K240s somewhat
less so. *However the MK2 version seem very bright and thin.

Must be catering to those with HF loss.

The only thing I use the HD280 for is tracking vocalists.

Funny, that's what I use *my* cans for. g

However I am happy
to use the ATs even for recreational listening, far more than the K240s..

geoff

I've some in-ears that I kinda' like, but I only use them with my iPod
or my computer.

They're Shure E2c's.

---Jeff- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -
________________________

Here we a http://www.headphonesolutions.com/

Anybody been there? How do your favorite head-huggers stack up?

Based on their reviews, the HD-280s I own are no mistake.

-CC

[Richard Crowley]

"ChrisCoaster" wrote ...
One theory of mine:
Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

The less perfectly flat, more colored headphones appeal to larger
groups(the "boomy bass" set or the "tinny treble" crowd).

I calibrate TV sets in my spare time for folks. They appreciate that
the picture conforms to broadcast/professional standards, but don't
particularly like the image. Complaints of the color not being bold
enough or that the picture is "too soft" abound. But crank the
contrast, color, & sharpness back up, and they're in heaven!

Thoughts on this?

You can probably figure out for yourself what is meant when we
refer to a graphic equalizer set for a "California Smile".

[Geoff]

ChrisCoaster wrote:
On Sep 30, 8:44 pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
And just those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me
that's a brand I should also consider.

I reviewed many headphones at Stereophile, and AKGs were among the
worst -- colored, and not particularly clean. I don't know why
they're so popular.
____________________
One theory of mine:

Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

That hearing is applied to all listening, not just headphone, and calibrates
their own norm.

geoff

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 30, 9:38*pm, "Richard Crowley" wrote:
"ChrisCoaster" wrote ...

One theory of mine:
Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

The less perfectly flat, more colored headphones appeal to larger
groups(the "boomy bass" set or the "tinny treble" crowd).

I calibrate TV sets in my spare time for folks. *They appreciate that
the picture conforms to broadcast/professional standards, but don't
particularly like the image. *Complaints of the color not being bold
enough or that the picture is "too soft" abound. *But crank the
contrast, color, & sharpness back up, and they're in heaven!

Thoughts on this?

You can probably figure out for yourself what is meant when we
refer to a graphic equalizer set for a "California Smile".
___________________
Uggh - how inefficient - and inaccurate! Either a transducer can
reproduce top and bottom with authority, or it can't!

Curving the EQ like that only muddles matters. However there is a
curve that can be used to emphasize the correct frequencies at softer
than average listening levels. Once called the "Fletcher Munson"
curve, it is now known generically as the Equal-Loudness Contour. It
moderately cuts frequencies just below and just above the core vocal
range, boosts the mid-treble region(8-12kHz), cuts most everything
above 16kHz, and progressively boosts frequencies from 250 down to
about 20Hz.

http://www.cnet.com/i/bto/20071012/FletcherMunson.png

I'm not saying phones or speakers should be curved like this, but this
is a useful loudness curve when listening at background levels.

-CC

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 30, 9:42*pm, "geoff" wrote:
ChrisCoaster wrote:
On Sep 30, 8:44 pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
And just those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me
that's a brand I should also consider.

I reviewed many headphones at Stereophile, and AKGs were among the
worst -- colored, and not particularly clean. I don't know why
they're so popular.
____________________
One theory of mine:

Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

That hearing is applied to all listening, not just headphone, and calibrates
their own norm.

geoff
________________
Yes. And your norm will sound different from my norm, which in turn
will differ from Suzy down the hall's norm, which will differ from the
norm for the guy changing tires at Sears, etc.

The point is, I actually prefer flat phones or speakers because I know
I'm getting accurate reproduction - even if they don't sound flat to
"my ears".

-CC

[ChrisCoaster]

On Sep 30, 9:42*pm, "geoff" wrote:
ChrisCoaster wrote:
On Sep 30, 8:44 pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
And just those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me
that's a brand I should also consider.

I reviewed many headphones at Stereophile, and AKGs were among the
worst -- colored, and not particularly clean. I don't know why
they're so popular.
____________________
One theory of mine:

Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

That hearing is applied to all listening, not just headphone, and calibrates
their own norm.

geoff
___________________________
For everyone:

Here is the site I've been dying for:
http://www.headphone.com/technical/p...are+Headphones

I hope the thing works, otherwise just type in www.headphone.com and
select up to four models to compare freq resp, impedance, etc. Looks
like my Sennies aren't that bad compared to some of the stuff in
there. But WHERE are the high-end Sonys? I used to own the 7506 -
basically a rebranded MDR-V6, and was most satisfied with the sound.

-CC

[Geoff]

ChrisCoaster wrote:

________________
Yes. And your norm will sound different from my norm, which in turn
will differ from Suzy down the hall's norm, which will differ from the
norm for the guy changing tires at Sears, etc.

The point is, I actually prefer flat phones or speakers because I know
I'm getting accurate reproduction - even if they don't sound flat to
"my ears".

Exactly - because the same ears are applied to the phones as to the 'real
world'.

geoff

[Richard Crowley]

"ChrisCoaster" wrote ...
"Richard Crowley" wrote:
You can probably figure out for yourself what is meant when we
refer to a graphic equalizer set for a "California Smile".
___________________
Uggh - how inefficient - and inaccurate! Either a transducer can
reproduce top and bottom with authority, or it can't!

Saying that someone set their EQ to a "California Smile" isn't meant
as a *compliment*, at least not among the Cognoscenti. :-)

[nebulax]

On Sep 30, 10:29*pm, ChrisCoaster wrote:
On Sep 30, 9:42*pm, "geoff" wrote:

ChrisCoaster wrote:
On Sep 30, 8:44 pm, "William Sommerwerck"
wrote:
And just those three letters - AKG - instinctively tells me
that's a brand I should also consider.

I reviewed many headphones at Stereophile, and AKGs were among the
worst -- colored, and not particularly clean. I don't know why
they're so popular.
____________________
One theory of mine:

Headphones(or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound appeal
to the least number of listeners because the majority of human beings
do not possess anything near flat hearing.

That hearing is applied to all listening, not just headphone, and calibrates
their own norm.

geoff

___________________________
For everyone:

Here is the site I've been dying for:http://www.headphone.com/technical/p.../build-a-graph...

I hope the thing works, otherwise just type inwww.headphone.comand
select up to four models to compare freq resp, impedance, etc. *Looks
like my Sennies aren't that bad compared to some of the stuff in
there. *But WHERE are the high-end Sonys? *I used to own the 7506 -
basically a rebranded MDR-V6, and was most satisfied with the sound.

-CC



To my ears, the V6/7506's are a bit too bright, and sometimes
painfully so. Granted, when you're using them in the field, they'll
point out details that might be lost on a murkier sounding pair of
cans, but I'd never use mine for 'relaxed home listening'.

-Neb

-Neb

[Bigguy[_4_]]

Wecan do it wrote:
"ChrisCoaster" wrote in message
...
It should be federal law that every house and home have at
least one
serious set of cans. In my case they are the Sennheiser
HD-280 Pro.
I have received nothing but pleasure from listening to
anything I've
plugged this model into and any style of music or even movie
audio.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can say
I "pretty-
much" know what a quality headphone is supposed to sound
like.

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth
the
investment and will I notice any difference between it and
the 280?

I ask this assuming that at least one or two folks on here
have
experienced Sennheiser products.

Thanks for your input,

-ChrisCoaster
"If you scream on roller-coasters you're missing the ride!!"

Lets talk Sennheiser HD600's. Nothing to complain about the
sound, I 've worn them for hours every night for a few years
now. I hook them to the center channel on the TV so I can
understand what is being said without blasting out my wife.
Extreem comfort.

These cans were made with break away 2 prong connectons on
each can. They never worked properly, always cutting out and
driving me crazy. I had to open up the outside screen cover
and solder the wires to the little tabs they put inside there.
Now after a couple of years I just opened them up again and
had to resolder them cause where I ty-wrapped the wire to the
can the super thin wires broke and they started cutting out
again. No I am not dancing with these things on just sitting
on a couch and watching TV. The cloth covered pads are holding
up but the black foam that protects the drivers from my ears
has fallen apart and disappeared long ago. I think they are
not too durable.

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot less.

peace
dawg


I've seen a few 'problems' with Senny 'phones where people have
unplugged the cable and then re-plugged it the wrong way round.
If you don't look closely you can miss the fact that there is a large
and a small pin (for correct phase) and force it in the wrong way round.

This gives intermittent dropout with cable movement.

We had an outbreak of this on our HD25s - 'educating' the talent fixed
things... ;-)

Guy

[Laurence Payne[_2_]]

On Wed, 30 Sep 2009 18:28:50 -0700 (PDT), ChrisCoaster
wrote:


I calibrate TV sets in my spare time for folks. They appreciate that
the picture conforms to broadcast/professional standards, but don't
particularly like the image. Complaints of the color not being bold
enough or that the picture is "too soft" abound. But crank the
contrast, color, & sharpness back up, and they're in heaven!

Thoughts on this?

If I'm going to pay for colour, I want LOTS of colour! If I'm going
to pay for a wide screen, I want the picture stretched to fill EVERY
inck, no matter what format it was transmitted in! That's my
priorities, and I'll adjust to the distortions they bring.

Also, my wife is beautiful and my children are bright.

[Arny Krueger]

"Richard Crowley" wrote in message


You can probably figure out for yourself what is meant
when we refer to a graphic equalizer set for a
"California Smile".

Given that people tend to listen to music at lower levels than it was
performed, and the frequency response of many home speakers, the "smile" has
some psychoacoustic justification.

[William Sommerwerck]

Headphones (or speakers) with especially flat, calibrated sound
appeal to the least number of listeners because the majority of
human beings do not possess anything near flat hearing.

That hearing is applied to all listening, not just headphone, and
calibrates their own norm.

Yes. And your norm will sound different from my norm, which in turn
will differ from Suzy down the hall's norm, which will differ from the
norm for the guy changing tires at Sears, etc.
The point is, I actually prefer flat phones or speakers because I know
I'm getting accurate reproduction -- even if they don't sound flat to
"my ears".


The problem is, if the phones don't sound flat to your ears -- then they
aren't flat.

Specifically... If the tonal balance * of the playback of a recording does
not match that of the live sound, then it follows that something is wrong.
Assuming that everything is "right" up to the speakers or headphones, then
the speakers or headphones aren't "flat".

Or more precisely, they don't have the response that your ears and brain
/interpret/ as flat. In other words, "measured flat" is not the same as
"perceived flat". This is one of the reasons STAX made an equalizer that
corrects for the subjective difference between "free field" listening and
headphone listening.

* I'm using this term as an overly simple substitute for "flat". There are
other aspects to flatness than just tonal balance.

[William Sommerwerck]

The point is, I actually prefer flat phones or speakers because
I know I'm getting accurate reproduction - even if they don't
sound flat to "my ears".

Exactly - because the same ears are applied to the phones
as to the 'real world'.

Yes, in theory. No, in practice. See my preceding post.

[Scott Dorsey]

ChrisCoaster wrote:

The point is, I actually prefer flat phones or speakers because I know
I'm getting accurate reproduction - even if they don't sound flat to
"my ears".

Problem is that they don't exist.

In the case of headphones, your ear canal is part of the system and the
volume of your ear canal will affect the low end response. So headphones
which measure accurately on my head may measure poorly on yours. Most
"flat" headphones are flat when measured with the IEC standard ear model,
which may not reflect your ears.

In the case of speakers... well... they get used in rooms. And I have
never seen a room that was flat +/- 3dB across the audible spectrum
throughout the room (although I have seen a COUPLE very carefully treated
studio facilities that were flat +/- 12dB across the spectrum throughout
the room and were +/- 3dB in a small sweet spot).
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

[Wecan do it]

"Bigguy" wrote in message
...
Wecan do it wrote:
"ChrisCoaster" wrote in message
...
It should be federal law that every house and home have at
least one
serious set of cans. In my case they are the Sennheiser
HD-280 Pro.
I have received nothing but pleasure from listening to
anything I've
plugged this model into and any style of music or even
movie audio.

I've previously owned the MDR-V6 and the V600, so I can
say I "pretty-
much" know what a quality headphone is supposed to sound
like.

That said, is the next Sennheiser up - the HD-380 - worth
the
investment and will I notice any difference between it and
the 280?

I ask this assuming that at least one or two folks on here
have
experienced Sennheiser products.

Thanks for your input,

-ChrisCoaster
"If you scream on roller-coasters you're missing the
ride!!"

Lets talk Sennheiser HD600's. Nothing to complain about the
sound, I 've worn them for hours every night for a few
years now. I hook them to the center channel on the TV so I
can understand what is being said without blasting out my
wife. Extreem comfort.

These cans were made with break away 2 prong connectons on
each can. They never worked properly, always cutting out
and driving me crazy. I had to open up the outside screen
cover and solder the wires to the little tabs they put
inside there. Now after a couple of years I just opened
them up again and had to resolder them cause where I
ty-wrapped the wire to the can the super thin wires broke
and they started cutting out again. No I am not dancing
with these things on just sitting on a couch and watching
TV. The cloth covered pads are holding up but the black
foam that protects the drivers from my ears has fallen
apart and disappeared long ago. I think they are not too
durable.

I have a set of AKG 240K I used for over 20 years and they
still are in one piece and sounding good too. Cost a lot
less.

peace
dawg


I've seen a few 'problems' with Senny 'phones where people
have unplugged the cable and then re-plugged it the wrong
way round.
If you don't look closely you can miss the fact that there
is a large and a small pin (for correct phase) and force it
in the wrong way round.

This gives intermittent dropout with cable movement.

We had an outbreak of this on our HD25s - 'educating' the
talent fixed things... ;-)

Guy

Your explanation seems plausible. If you are correct then it
looks like another instance of poor German engineering. If you
key a connector for phase then don't do it half way so the
casual user can plug it in backwards by mistake and cause an
intermittent dropout condition. Who is going to educate the
f*cktarded engineers at Sennheiser and who is going to give me
a new set of HD600's without the design problem.

Another time I took home a set of Sennheiser wireless cans.
They worked for about 15 feet then became intermittent.
Checking on the internet after my purchase showed that many
other unsatisfied buyers found that the wireless model had a
poor mechanical attachment which resulted in the can breaking
off the headband and Sennheiser having designed it so no
replacement parts could fix it. I took that product back for
a refund

This kind of poor engineering is why I will only have one set
of Sennheiser cans until these die, then I will have none.

I do have 3 of their 421 mics that I like.

Dont give these jokers any more of your money.

peace
dawg

[Geoff]

nebulax wrote:
To my ears, the V6/7506's are a bit too bright, and sometimes
painfully so. Granted, when you're using them in the field, they'll
point out details that might be lost on a murkier sounding pair of
cans, but I'd never use mine for 'relaxed home listening'.

The ATH-M50s have similar trouser-flapping bass to the 7506s, but lack the
wasp-sting treble.


geoff

[Geoff]

geoff wrote:
nebulax wrote:
To my ears, the V6/7506's are a bit too bright, and sometimes
painfully so. Granted, when you're using them in the field, they'll
point out details that might be lost on a murkier sounding pair of
cans, but I'd never use mine for 'relaxed home listening'.

The ATH-M50s have similar trouser-flapping bass to the 7506s, but
lack the wasp-sting treble.


Replying to myself might seem a bit lame, but bass-wise both the 7506s and
ATH-M50s give me the same bass listening experience as my 20Hz-20KHz stereo
speakers.

geoff