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  #1   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon
  #2   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message

is my burner adding the click?


It's doubtful.

is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Yes. You must expand the waveform along the time line and be certain
that you make a clean cut at a point where the waveform crosses the
'zero' point. That is, you cannot cut at a point where the wave is moving
to the positive or negative side of zero without chancing a DC spike, or
a pop.

thanks for any help!


Another method to eliminate the DC pop would be to do a short fade-in
and fade-out on each 'split' file.

Also, when you reassemble the files for burning, depending on the software,
you can possibly crossfade from one file to the other, making the result
appear to be seamless.

--
David Morgan (MAMS)
http://www.m-a-m-s.com
http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com


  #6   Report Post  
Sugarite
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon


Might be your burning software not quite putting absolutely no pause
inbetween tracks.


  #7   Report Post  
Sugarite
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon


Might be your burning software not quite putting absolutely no pause
inbetween tracks.


  #8   Report Post  
Clive Backham
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700, (XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.
  #9   Report Post  
Clive Backham
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700, (XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.
  #10   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

"Sugarite" wrote in message ...
hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon


Might be your burning software not quite putting absolutely no pause
inbetween tracks.


well, like i said, i don't always get the clicks. some
segues come out perfect sounding. here is another question.
when you split at a zero point, do both the left and right
channels have to be crossing the zero line?


  #11   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

"Sugarite" wrote in message ...
hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon


Might be your burning software not quite putting absolutely no pause
inbetween tracks.


well, like i said, i don't always get the clicks. some
segues come out perfect sounding. here is another question.
when you split at a zero point, do both the left and right
channels have to be crossing the zero line?
  #12   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

(Clive Backham) wrote in message ...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.



OK this sounds like what my problem is.
does anyone know how to split on block boundaries in sound forge?
  #13   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

(Clive Backham) wrote in message ...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.



OK this sounds like what my problem is.
does anyone know how to split on block boundaries in sound forge?
  #16   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message ...

here is another question.
when you split at a zero point, do both the left and right
channels have to be crossing the zero line?


Yes... as closed as humanly possible. The waveform interpolation
may not be 100% correct, so minute fade-ins can help.

DM


  #17   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message ...

here is another question.
when you split at a zero point, do both the left and right
channels have to be crossing the zero line?


Yes... as closed as humanly possible. The waveform interpolation
may not be 100% correct, so minute fade-ins can help.

DM


  #18   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message om...
(CH) wrote in message . com...
(XQJ37) wrote in message . com...
hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon




When you split the large file into smaller files are you creating the
splits at zero crossing points? Not sure if that's it, but it could
be.
-CH


i have experienced clicks even when i hit a zero point.
when i analyze store bought cds with segues it seems that
they don't always hit on a zero point. someone told me to
try cd archetect. that may solve it. but otherwise i really
like soundforge.


Architect is a sister program to Forge. The newer version is cumbersome
and gives the user too darn many unecessary options - but after the majority
of the editing work is done in Forge, the files are moved to Architect in order
to burn. At that stage, crossfades between files can be performed and IDs
placed where you choose. Burning DAO will usually prevent the symptoms
that Clive describes, however, accidentally placing a marker so that the
audio un-mutes on a voltage higher than near zero will cause the pop as
well if you are searching by ID rather than doing a continuous listen.

--
David Morgan (MAMS)
http://www.m-a-m-s.com
http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com







  #19   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message om...
(CH) wrote in message . com...
(XQJ37) wrote in message . com...
hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?
thanks for any help!
-jon




When you split the large file into smaller files are you creating the
splits at zero crossing points? Not sure if that's it, but it could
be.
-CH


i have experienced clicks even when i hit a zero point.
when i analyze store bought cds with segues it seems that
they don't always hit on a zero point. someone told me to
try cd archetect. that may solve it. but otherwise i really
like soundforge.


Architect is a sister program to Forge. The newer version is cumbersome
and gives the user too darn many unecessary options - but after the majority
of the editing work is done in Forge, the files are moved to Architect in order
to burn. At that stage, crossfades between files can be performed and IDs
placed where you choose. Burning DAO will usually prevent the symptoms
that Clive describes, however, accidentally placing a marker so that the
audio un-mutes on a voltage higher than near zero will cause the pop as
well if you are searching by ID rather than doing a continuous listen.

--
David Morgan (MAMS)
http://www.m-a-m-s.com
http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com







  #20   Report Post  
Geoff Wood
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message

well, like i said, i don't always get the clicks. some
segues come out perfect sounding. here is another question.
when you split at a zero point, do both the left and right
channels have to be crossing the zero line?


Depends which channel you want the click in !

geoff




  #21   Report Post  
Geoff Wood
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?


"XQJ37" wrote in message

well, like i said, i don't always get the clicks. some
segues come out perfect sounding. here is another question.
when you split at a zero point, do both the left and right
channels have to be crossing the zero line?


Depends which channel you want the click in !

geoff


  #22   Report Post  
Arny Krueger
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

"XQJ37" wrote in message
om
(Clive Backham) wrote in message
...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:


A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not
an exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will
pad the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost
certainly the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure
that you split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then
burn the CD in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause
between tracks). I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would
have expected there might be some way to tell it to place split
points at CD block boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs
out there that will do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best
known one. My own program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also
do the job, but if all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is
easier to use.


That's it. There is a natural granularity (1 frame) to CD tracks, and if
files don't fade to zero at each end, the odds of clicks are pretty good
when you try to butt them together.

OK this sounds like what my problem is.


Fractional frames are padded out with zeroes, and if the adjoining data is
non-zero you get clicks.

does anyone know how to split on block boundaries in sound forge?


There should be an option for setting the time base to be in frames, which I
believe forces all files to begin and end on frame boundaries.


  #23   Report Post  
Arny Krueger
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

"XQJ37" wrote in message
om
(Clive Backham) wrote in message
...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:


A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not
an exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will
pad the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost
certainly the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure
that you split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then
burn the CD in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause
between tracks). I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would
have expected there might be some way to tell it to place split
points at CD block boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs
out there that will do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best
known one. My own program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also
do the job, but if all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is
easier to use.


That's it. There is a natural granularity (1 frame) to CD tracks, and if
files don't fade to zero at each end, the odds of clicks are pretty good
when you try to butt them together.

OK this sounds like what my problem is.


Fractional frames are padded out with zeroes, and if the adjoining data is
non-zero you get clicks.

does anyone know how to split on block boundaries in sound forge?


There should be an option for setting the time base to be in frames, which I
believe forces all files to begin and end on frame boundaries.


  #24   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

(Clive Backham) wrote in message ...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.


this was the info that helped me...thanks
i split the tracks up and made sure that the total sample
length was divisible by 588 and I got perfectly clickless
segues. and the splits don't have to be a zero crossings.
  #25   Report Post  
XQJ37
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

(Clive Backham) wrote in message ...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.


this was the info that helped me...thanks
i split the tracks up and made sure that the total sample
length was divisible by 588 and I got perfectly clickless
segues. and the splits don't have to be a zero crossings.


  #26   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

Excellent. I've never seen this problem in CDArchitect or Toast,
so this information was very new to me since it never came up.
A great tidbit to know.... thanks Clive.

--
David Morgan (MAMS)
http://www.m-a-m-s.com
http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com

"XQJ37" wrote in message om...
(Clive Backham) wrote in message ...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.


this was the info that helped me...thanks
i split the tracks up and made sure that the total sample
length was divisible by 588 and I got perfectly clickless
segues. and the splits don't have to be a zero crossings.



  #27   Report Post  
David Morgan \(MAMS\)
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

Excellent. I've never seen this problem in CDArchitect or Toast,
so this information was very new to me since it never came up.
A great tidbit to know.... thanks Clive.

--
David Morgan (MAMS)
http://www.m-a-m-s.com
http://www.artisan-recordingstudio.com

"XQJ37" wrote in message om...
(Clive Backham) wrote in message ...
On 25 Sep 2003 11:54:54 -0700,
(XQJ37) wrote:

hello pro audio people
i use sound forge all the time for splitting up tracks. for example
when i record a concert on tape then prepare it for cd. my problem is
when i split a track during crowd noise before a song starts, after i
burn it to cd, maybe
50% of the time, i hear a click when the tracks move from one to
another when i listen to the cd. if i copy the files back to my
computer and rejoin them, there is no click. i have analyzed store
bought cds that have songs which segue and it seems there is no
particular spot that they split them, yet there is never a problem
with a click when you listen. is my burner adding the click?
is there a special point in the wave file where you should split the
tracks?


Others have suggested to make sure you make the splits at
zero-crossing points, and that will certainly help, but it is merely
reducing the effect rather than addressing the cause.

A CD is organised in blocks, each block being 1/75th second long (588
samples). If you present a file to be burned as a track that is not an
exact multiple of 588 samples, then the CD writing software will pad
the last block out (usually with silence). This is almost certainly
the source of the clicks you hear. You have to make sure that you
split the large file up on CD block boundaries (and then burn the CD
in Disc At Once mode to ensure there can be no pause between tracks).
I'm not that familiar with Sound Forge, but would have expected there
might be some way to tell it to place split points at CD block
boundaries. If not, there are very cheap programs out there that will
do the job. CD Wave (
www.cdwave.com) is the best known one. My own
program Wave Repair (www.waverepair.com) will also do the job, but if
all you want is track splitting, CD Wave is easier to use.


this was the info that helped me...thanks
i split the tracks up and made sure that the total sample
length was divisible by 588 and I got perfectly clickless
segues. and the splits don't have to be a zero crossings.



  #28   Report Post  
W. Williams
 
Posts: n/a
Default splitting tracks in sound forge - avoiding clicks?

"David Morgan (MAMS)" wrote:
Excellent. I've never seen this problem in CDArchitect or Toast,
so this information was very new to me since it never came up.
A great tidbit to know.... thanks Clive.


You should not experience this in CDArchitect, Toast or any other decent
software when using DAO burning. The original poster is apparently using
SoundForge, which is only capable of TAO burning, requiring the laser to
switch off after each track and on again for each new track. DAO burning
treats all the tracks as one file, so only the end of the last track in the
programme may be subject to padding.

W


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