I've adjusted the playback electronics on my MX5050 so that when
playing back a 1k tone off the test tape, I get 1.228 v at the output
and show 0 on the VU meter. When I got to adjusting the record level,
the Otari manual had the following to say:


3-6-(4) RECORD LEVEL ADJUSTMENT

This adjustment should be made at 15 ips for high speed models and 7
1/2 ips for low speed models.

12. Set audio oscillator freqeuncy to 1kHz and output level -15dBm.
13. Set INPUT LINE control to full clockwise position. Set SRL switch
to SRL. Set MONITOR switch to TAPE.
14. Start record mode. Adjust REC LEVEL potentiometer for 0 VU on VU
meter.

3-6-(5) RECORD LEVEL CALIBRATION

This calibration should be made after the record level adjustment
continuously.

15. Set MONITOR switch to SOURCE position.
16. Calibrate Rec. CAL. potentiometer so that VU meter inicates 0 VU.



What's confusing me (aside from the "adjustment continuosly") is the
instruction to set the oscillator level for -15dBm. Given the rest of
the instruction, shouldn't it be set to 1.228 v (+4dBu?) so that 1.228
v in gives you 1.228 v out off the play head? Isn't that 19dB below
what I'd want to use? What am I missing?

In article writes:

3-6-(4) RECORD LEVEL ADJUSTMENT

12. Set audio oscillator freqeuncy to 1kHz and output level -15dBm.
13. Set INPUT LINE control to full clockwise position. Set SRL switch
to SRL. Set MONITOR switch to TAPE.
14. Start record mode. Adjust REC LEVEL potentiometer for 0 VU on VU
meter.

I don't have a manual or a recorder here to try to interpret this for
you but I can see why it's confusing. When the SRL switch is in the
SRL position, it should disable the line input level control and set
it so that +4 dBu (or whatever you choose for your standard record
level) can be calibrated for a playback level of 0 VU (which has
previously been calibrated to +4 dBu (1.23 V).

Perhaps with the SRL switch off and the input level control set fully
clockwise, there's enough gain so that "-15 dBm" (which isn't a
voltage level but it's a common mistake) will give the normal
recording level.

I'd verify that with SRL switched on, adjusting the line input level
control doesn't change the record (as indicated by monitoring the
playback) level, and then put in +4 dBu and adjust the record level
pot (internal) so the VU meter reads a playback level of 0 VU.


3-6-(5) RECORD LEVEL CALIBRATION

This calibration should be made after the record level adjustment
continuously.

15. Set MONITOR switch to SOURCE position.
16. Calibrate Rec. CAL. potentiometer so that VU meter inicates 0 VU.

This adjusts the VU meter calibration so that it reads 0 when you have
the signal level going in that gives you 0 VU playback level.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

In article writes:

3-6-(4) RECORD LEVEL ADJUSTMENT

12. Set audio oscillator freqeuncy to 1kHz and output level -15dBm.
13. Set INPUT LINE control to full clockwise position. Set SRL switch
to SRL. Set MONITOR switch to TAPE.
14. Start record mode. Adjust REC LEVEL potentiometer for 0 VU on VU
meter.

I don't have a manual or a recorder here to try to interpret this for
you but I can see why it's confusing. When the SRL switch is in the
SRL position, it should disable the line input level control and set
it so that +4 dBu (or whatever you choose for your standard record
level) can be calibrated for a playback level of 0 VU (which has
previously been calibrated to +4 dBu (1.23 V).

Perhaps with the SRL switch off and the input level control set fully
clockwise, there's enough gain so that "-15 dBm" (which isn't a
voltage level but it's a common mistake) will give the normal
recording level.

I'd verify that with SRL switched on, adjusting the line input level
control doesn't change the record (as indicated by monitoring the
playback) level, and then put in +4 dBu and adjust the record level
pot (internal) so the VU meter reads a playback level of 0 VU.


3-6-(5) RECORD LEVEL CALIBRATION

This calibration should be made after the record level adjustment
continuously.

15. Set MONITOR switch to SOURCE position.
16. Calibrate Rec. CAL. potentiometer so that VU meter inicates 0 VU.

This adjusts the VU meter calibration so that it reads 0 when you have
the signal level going in that gives you 0 VU playback level.

--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

(Mike Rivers) wrote in message news:znr1100795300k@trad...
In article writes:

3-6-(4) RECORD LEVEL ADJUSTMENT

12. Set audio oscillator freqeuncy to 1kHz and output level -15dBm.
13. Set INPUT LINE control to full clockwise position. Set SRL switch
to SRL. Set MONITOR switch to TAPE.
14. Start record mode. Adjust REC LEVEL potentiometer for 0 VU on VU
meter.

I don't have a manual or a recorder here to try to interpret this for
you but I can see why it's confusing. When the SRL switch is in the
SRL position, it should disable the line input level control and set
it so that +4 dBu (or whatever you choose for your standard record
level) can be calibrated for a playback level of 0 VU (which has
previously been calibrated to +4 dBu (1.23 V).

Thanks Mike.
The SRL disables the Playback Level knobs on the front of the deck -
no effect on the Input Level knobs. The big Input Level knobs on the
front of the deck (the ones they say to turn full clockwise) do
interact with the internal "Record Level" trim pot. If I put 1.228
volts in with the Input Level fully clockwise, I can't trim the Record
Level back far enough to get 1.228 out (in fact the VU meter is
pegged). With the Record Level trim backed all the way down, I need to
back the Input Level knobs down about 1/3 of the way to get 1.228 on
output off the play head. It seems like I shouldn't have to back the
Record Level all the way down, so I suspect somethings wrong with this
approach.

Perhaps with the SRL switch off and the input level control set fully
clockwise, there's enough gain so that "-15 dBm" (which isn't a
voltage level but it's a common mistake) will give the normal
recording level.

How would I set the oscillator for -15dBm?

(Mike Rivers) wrote in message news:znr1100795300k@trad...
In article writes:

3-6-(4) RECORD LEVEL ADJUSTMENT

12. Set audio oscillator freqeuncy to 1kHz and output level -15dBm.
13. Set INPUT LINE control to full clockwise position. Set SRL switch
to SRL. Set MONITOR switch to TAPE.
14. Start record mode. Adjust REC LEVEL potentiometer for 0 VU on VU
meter.

I don't have a manual or a recorder here to try to interpret this for
you but I can see why it's confusing. When the SRL switch is in the
SRL position, it should disable the line input level control and set
it so that +4 dBu (or whatever you choose for your standard record
level) can be calibrated for a playback level of 0 VU (which has
previously been calibrated to +4 dBu (1.23 V).

Thanks Mike.
The SRL disables the Playback Level knobs on the front of the deck -
no effect on the Input Level knobs. The big Input Level knobs on the
front of the deck (the ones they say to turn full clockwise) do
interact with the internal "Record Level" trim pot. If I put 1.228
volts in with the Input Level fully clockwise, I can't trim the Record
Level back far enough to get 1.228 out (in fact the VU meter is
pegged). With the Record Level trim backed all the way down, I need to
back the Input Level knobs down about 1/3 of the way to get 1.228 on
output off the play head. It seems like I shouldn't have to back the
Record Level all the way down, so I suspect somethings wrong with this
approach.

Perhaps with the SRL switch off and the input level control set fully
clockwise, there's enough gain so that "-15 dBm" (which isn't a
voltage level but it's a common mistake) will give the normal
recording level.

How would I set the oscillator for -15dBm?

In article writes:

The SRL disables the Playback Level knobs on the front of the deck -
no effect on the Input Level knobs.

That's what I thought (my MX55 is the same way) which is why I was
confused when it appeared in the instructions for setting the record
calibration. I guess I just expected that you'd know to do that.

The big Input Level knobs on the
front of the deck (the ones they say to turn full clockwise) do
interact with the internal "Record Level" trim pot. If I put 1.228
volts in with the Input Level fully clockwise, I can't trim the Record
Level back far enough to get 1.228 out (in fact the VU meter is
pegged). With the Record Level trim backed all the way down, I need to
back the Input Level knobs down about 1/3 of the way to get 1.228 on
output off the play head. It seems like I shouldn't have to back the
Record Level all the way down, so I suspect somethings wrong with this
approach.

This is why they tell you to apply a signal at less than +4 dBu when
the level control is set fully clockwise.

How would I set the oscillator for -15dBm?

By measuring the output with a voltmenter. And since the recorder has
a relatively high input impedance (certainly not 600 ohms) you'd want
to set the oscillator to -15 dBu, not -15 dBm. dBu is voltage measured
into an open circuit, where dBm is actually a power measurement (dB
relative to 1 milliwatt) and with audio equipment, generally is
measured with a voltmeter with the generator operating into a 600 ohm
load. Ohm's Law tells us that 0.775 volts across 600 ohms is 1 mW.

But to answer your real question, set the output of the oscillator to
0.14 volts and you'll be close enough.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

In article writes:

The SRL disables the Playback Level knobs on the front of the deck -
no effect on the Input Level knobs.

That's what I thought (my MX55 is the same way) which is why I was
confused when it appeared in the instructions for setting the record
calibration. I guess I just expected that you'd know to do that.

The big Input Level knobs on the
front of the deck (the ones they say to turn full clockwise) do
interact with the internal "Record Level" trim pot. If I put 1.228
volts in with the Input Level fully clockwise, I can't trim the Record
Level back far enough to get 1.228 out (in fact the VU meter is
pegged). With the Record Level trim backed all the way down, I need to
back the Input Level knobs down about 1/3 of the way to get 1.228 on
output off the play head. It seems like I shouldn't have to back the
Record Level all the way down, so I suspect somethings wrong with this
approach.

This is why they tell you to apply a signal at less than +4 dBu when
the level control is set fully clockwise.

How would I set the oscillator for -15dBm?

By measuring the output with a voltmenter. And since the recorder has
a relatively high input impedance (certainly not 600 ohms) you'd want
to set the oscillator to -15 dBu, not -15 dBm. dBu is voltage measured
into an open circuit, where dBm is actually a power measurement (dB
relative to 1 milliwatt) and with audio equipment, generally is
measured with a voltmeter with the generator operating into a 600 ohm
load. Ohm's Law tells us that 0.775 volts across 600 ohms is 1 mW.

But to answer your real question, set the output of the oscillator to
0.14 volts and you'll be close enough.



--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

(Mike Rivers) wrote in message news:znr1100903045k@trad...
In article writes:

The SRL disables the Playback Level knobs on the front of the deck -
no effect on the Input Level knobs.

That's what I thought (my MX55 is the same way) which is why I was
confused when it appeared in the instructions for setting the record
calibration. I guess I just expected that you'd know to do that.

The big Input Level knobs on the
front of the deck (the ones they say to turn full clockwise) do
interact with the internal "Record Level" trim pot. If I put 1.228
volts in with the Input Level fully clockwise, I can't trim the Record
Level back far enough to get 1.228 out (in fact the VU meter is
pegged). With the Record Level trim backed all the way down, I need to
back the Input Level knobs down about 1/3 of the way to get 1.228 on
output off the play head. It seems like I shouldn't have to back the
Record Level all the way down, so I suspect somethings wrong with this
approach.

This is why they tell you to apply a signal at less than +4 dBu when
the level control is set fully clockwise.

How would I set the oscillator for -15dBm?

By measuring the output with a voltmenter. And since the recorder has
a relatively high input impedance (certainly not 600 ohms) you'd want
to set the oscillator to -15 dBu, not -15 dBm. dBu is voltage measured
into an open circuit, where dBm is actually a power measurement (dB
relative to 1 milliwatt) and with audio equipment, generally is
measured with a voltmeter with the generator operating into a 600 ohm
load. Ohm's Law tells us that 0.775 volts across 600 ohms is 1 mW.

But to answer your real question, set the output of the oscillator to
0.14 volts and you'll be close enough.

Got it, Thanks. I had to pad down the output of my oscillator, then
all seemd to go alright. Out of curiousity, why would the level for
the oscillator be given in dBm if the recorder's input is not 600
ohms?

(Mike Rivers) wrote in message news:znr1100903045k@trad...
In article writes:

The SRL disables the Playback Level knobs on the front of the deck -
no effect on the Input Level knobs.

That's what I thought (my MX55 is the same way) which is why I was
confused when it appeared in the instructions for setting the record
calibration. I guess I just expected that you'd know to do that.

The big Input Level knobs on the
front of the deck (the ones they say to turn full clockwise) do
interact with the internal "Record Level" trim pot. If I put 1.228
volts in with the Input Level fully clockwise, I can't trim the Record
Level back far enough to get 1.228 out (in fact the VU meter is
pegged). With the Record Level trim backed all the way down, I need to
back the Input Level knobs down about 1/3 of the way to get 1.228 on
output off the play head. It seems like I shouldn't have to back the
Record Level all the way down, so I suspect somethings wrong with this
approach.

This is why they tell you to apply a signal at less than +4 dBu when
the level control is set fully clockwise.

How would I set the oscillator for -15dBm?

By measuring the output with a voltmenter. And since the recorder has
a relatively high input impedance (certainly not 600 ohms) you'd want
to set the oscillator to -15 dBu, not -15 dBm. dBu is voltage measured
into an open circuit, where dBm is actually a power measurement (dB
relative to 1 milliwatt) and with audio equipment, generally is
measured with a voltmeter with the generator operating into a 600 ohm
load. Ohm's Law tells us that 0.775 volts across 600 ohms is 1 mW.

But to answer your real question, set the output of the oscillator to
0.14 volts and you'll be close enough.

Got it, Thanks. I had to pad down the output of my oscillator, then
all seemd to go alright. Out of curiousity, why would the level for
the oscillator be given in dBm if the recorder's input is not 600
ohms?

In article writes:

Out of curiousity, why would the level for
the oscillator be given in dBm if the recorder's input is not 600
ohms?

Ignorance. You can't even blame this on bad translation from the
Japanese, because dBm is the same in both languages.


--
I'm really Mike Rivers )
However, until the spam goes away or Hell freezes over,
lots of IP addresses are blocked from this system. If
you e-mail me and it bounces, use your secret decoder ring
and reach me he double-m-eleven-double-zero at yahoo

In article znr1101251951k@trad, Mike Rivers wrote:
In article writes:

Out of curiousity, why would the level for
the oscillator be given in dBm if the recorder's input is not 600
ohms?

Ignorance. You can't even blame this on bad translation from the
Japanese, because dBm is the same in both languages.

Everybody does it, though. It's meaningless, but common on data sheets.
The transition from power-transfer to voltage-transfer lines and measurements
has been going on for a long time and folks STILL aren't quite ready.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."