[DarkSide of Nightmix]

"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

[GregS[_3_]]

In article , DarkSide of Nightmix wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

Unfortunately many of those LP guys also sell CD's to make a living
and many are going bust with mass merchandising Walmart and the like. The
The record shops can't even buy things as cheap as what Walmart is selling them
for

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08235/906256-28.stm

http://www.recordrama.com/

greg

[MiNe 109]

In article ,
(GregS) wrote:

In article , DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

Unfortunately many of those LP guys also sell CD's to make a living

What's unfortunate about selling both cds and lps?

and many are going bust with mass merchandising Walmart and the like. The
The record shops can't even buy things as cheap as what Walmart is selling
them
for

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08235/906256-28.stm

http://www.recordrama.com/

Lps will remain a niche product and I don't think Walmart sells them at
all.

Stephen

[Clyde Slick]

On Aug 25, 10:59*am, (GregS) wrote:
In article , DarkSide of Nightmix wrote:

"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week:http://atu.ca/6aecf

Unfortunately many of those LP guys also sell CD's to make a living
and many are going bust with mass merchandising Walmart and the like. The
The record shops can't even buy things as cheap as what Walmart is selling them
for

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08235/906256-28.stm

http://www.recordrama.com/

greg

go into a WalMart and see the lousy selection.
Compare it to Borders. here they got 2 half empty racks, one aisle of
pop

[Arny Krueger]

"DarkSide of Nightmix"
wrote in message

"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

A little more context:

"Rising LP sales are proving that every fashion comes back if you stick
around long enough. The Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA)
reports that shipments of vinyl records, measured by dollar value, increased
36.6% from 2006 to 2007. But, while demand for albums has increased, record
sales remain significantly lower than those of compact discs and digital
media. More than half a billion CDs were purchased in 2007, compared with
about 1.3 million vinyl LPs.

"Demand for records has grown, but it's kind of like the dandelion in the
weed patch," says Geoff Mayfield, chart director at Billboard magazine.
"Growth is high because the base is so small." The RIAA declined to comment.

[Clyde Slick]

On 25 Aug, 12:32, ScottW wrote:
On Aug 25, 9:12*am, "Arny Krueger" wrote:

"DarkSide of Nightmix"
wrote in ter

"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week:http://atu.ca/6aecf

A little more context:

"Rising LP sales are proving that every fashion comes back if you stick
around long enough. The Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA)
reports that shipments of vinyl records, measured by dollar value, increased
36.6% from 2006 to 2007.

*Is there any unit sales increase or has the dollar value grown
as the mix of lp sales shifts toward the price point of analog
productions
and classic records?

shifts from 'what else' that was more prevalent, in the past 10 years?
Anyway, Sundazed has been up and coming at lower prices
than AP and Classic. Same or even less a typical cd in most cases

[[email protected]]

On Aug 25, 7:25*am, DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week:http://atu.ca/6aecf

The sound you get depends so much on the equipment you have that
"warm" and "cold" are meaningless for an individual listener.
What matters is that some of the 50s and 60s LPs., before the
"improvements" began, contain unrivalled performances of the classics
by such as Ansermet, Furtwangler and superb chamber music quartets and
quintets superbly recorded eg. Budapest playing Beethoven quartetsa.
For all I know pop may sound better on CDs.
Ludovic Mirabel

[Geoff]

GregS wrote:
In article , DarkSide of
Nightmix wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

Unfortunately many of those LP guys also sell CD's to make a living

Phew, so the puinter CAN hear what the master is meant to sound like then
....

geoff

[[email protected]]

On Aug 25, 3:32 pm, " wrote:
On Aug 25, 7:25 am, DarkSide of Nightmix

wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week:http://atu.ca/6aecf

The sound you get depends so much on the equipment you have that
"warm" and "cold" are meaningless for an individual listener.
What matters is that some of the 50s and 60s LPs., before the
"improvements" began, contain unrivalled performances of the classics
by such as Ansermet, Furtwangler and superb chamber music quartets and
quintets superbly recorded eg. Budapest playing Beethoven quartetsa.
For all I know pop may sound better on CDs.
Ludovic Mirabel

Yes, but....the necessary signal processing needed to enable them to
be cut with a $20K Neumann head without danger of tearing it up means
LESS realism. LESS dynamic range. LESS detail. Properly mastered, even
the old red book CD beats vinyl.

That said-the vinyl was mastered from fresh tapes which today may not
exist.

But since you have no technical knowledge and are apparently proud of
it, I wouldn't expect you to comprehend.

Where is Mr. Ludwig when we need him??????

[[email protected]]

Most of the new, overpriced vinyl is sold by niche catalog/internet
people like Chad Kassem and other bull**** artists.

[Clyde Slick]

On 26 Aug, 16:46, wrote:

*Where is Mr. Ludwig when we need him??????-

http://img398.imageshack.us/img398/1...rseptocst9.jpg

[Peter Larsen[_3_]]

geoff wrote:

GregS wrote:

In article , DarkSide of
Nightmix wrote:

"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

Unfortunately many of those LP guys also sell CD's to make a living

Phew, so the puinter CAN hear what the master is meant to sound like
then ...

One example known of the lp having A dynamic range and the cd not, ie.
totally different masterings, with the large dynamic range audio on the
small dynamic range hardware format. Based on actually analyzing a resonably
large selection of vinyl and cd's the general difference is that old vinyl
has large actually used dynamic range than new cd's. Which is to say that
the listener preference appears to be one of less manipulated - or better
manipulated - audio and not one of one of the formats actually sounding
better than the other. Most of the format characteristic differences vanish
when the lp is played back in a silent room anyway ....

geoff

Kind regards

Peter Larsen

[Steven Sullivan]

In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.




--
-S
A wise man, therefore, proportions his belief to the evidence. -- David Hume, "On Miracles"
(1748)

[Arny Krueger]

"Steven Sullivan" wrote in message

In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm
sound) aren't back from the dead; they were never quite
buried in the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the
source tape.

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

Q = 1.2-2.5 rise of a few dB around 150-200 Hz.

Roll off those nasty thuddy dark lows below about 90 Hz.

Overall downward slope of -0.5 to -1 dB/octave from 20-20 kHz.

Q=8-12 notch of 3-9 dB around 9 kHz.

Gently roll off above highs about 6-8 KHz at -6 to -12 dB/octave.

Advanced processing that is easy enough with good DAW software, but can't be
done with just an eq:

Add just a little 60, 120, 180 Hz hum.

Overall dynamics compression to eliminate hard-to-hear quiet passages,
and ear-shattering loud passages.

Add even-order distortion to loud passages

Add red-shaped noise to low-level passages

Add just a little modulation noise

Random or cyclic changes to channel balance and phase to widen perceived
soundstage.

[George M. Middius[_4_]]

Stupey Sillybot's back is up. What's scaring Stupey? Why, some hideously
uninhibited Normal mentioned [gasp!] vinyl recordings!

"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.

The horror! They're talking about LPs in public! And -- get this --
THEY'RE NOT WAVING PITCHFORKS AND TORCHES!!

Who can blame Stupey for reacting like this? He was minding his own
business, peacefully building up his Fortress Of Audio Safety (known to
Normals as a crypt). And along comes a Normal who DARES to mention the
Forbidden Truth. Of course Sillybot is terrified. What 'borg wouldn't be?

[AZ Nomad[_2_]]

On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

[Andrew Barss[_2_]]

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger wrote:

: Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an equalizer.

: How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this automatically, i.e. a
"vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given that some people (claim to) really enjoy
the sound of vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.


-- Andy Barss

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger wrote:

: Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an equalizer.

: How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this automatically, i.e. a
"vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given that some people (claim to) really enjoy
the sound of vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.


-- Andy Barss

Why do you say, "claim to"?

[AZ Nomad[_2_]]

On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 15:47:25 +0000 (UTC), Andrew Barss wrote:
In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger wrote:

: Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an equalizer.

: How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this automatically, i.e. a
"vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given that some people (claim to) really enjoy
the sound of vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

They're called thousand dollar cables.

[GregS[_3_]]

In article , AZ Nomad wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan
wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

Warm sound is generally made by reducing frequencies around 2 kHz.

greg

[Chronic Philharmonic]

"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan
wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when
audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such
progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

A worn out record being played with a worn out stylus never sounded warm to
me. It sounds noisy, fuzzy and distorted. Reducing frequencies above about
5kHz might provide some relief from that, but it isn't high fidelity. As far
as that goes, "warm" isn't a term I would associate with high fidelity
either. Accuracy, perhaps.

Since recording a live event (or generating the illusion of a live event in
the studio) is an art form, high fidelity is a complex concept. IMHO, the
most neutral medium and reproduction equipment would be the best way to
reproduce the original sound. Vinyl, and most analog storage technology is
measurably and objectively nowhere near as neutral as modern digital
technology. Flame on...

[Arny Krueger]

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given that
some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of vinyl,
this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl might have nothing to
do with actual sound quality.

[GregS[_3_]]

In article , (GregS) wrote:
In article , AZ Nomad
wrote:
On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan
wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

Warm sound is generally made by reducing frequencies around 2 kHz.

I always assumed since the ear is most sensitive in this region, its the first thing that gets
overloaded. I think some of the old records had presense peaks around 1 kHz.

greg

[AZ Nomad[_2_]]

On Fri, 29 Aug 2008 05:20:01 GMT, Chronic Philharmonic wrote:


"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan
wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when
audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such
progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

A worn out record being played with a worn out stylus never sounded warm to
me. It sounds noisy, fuzzy and distorted. Reducing frequencies above about
5kHz might provide some relief from that, but it isn't high fidelity. As far
as that goes, "warm" isn't a term I would associate with high fidelity
either. Accuracy, perhaps.

Since recording a live event (or generating the illusion of a live event in
the studio) is an art form, high fidelity is a complex concept. IMHO, the
most neutral medium and reproduction equipment would be the best way to
reproduce the original sound. Vinyl, and most analog storage technology is
measurably and objectively nowhere near as neutral as modern digital
technology. Flame on...

No argument here, but I didn't have a $10K phono investment to rationalize when
CD's first came out. Mine's $10K! It has to sound better than a $300 CD
player! That muffled sound has to be better... Let's give it a name... warm!

[nobody]

On 2008-08-29, Chronic Philharmonic wrote:


"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan
wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when
audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such
progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

A worn out record being played with a worn out stylus never sounded warm to
me. It sounds noisy, fuzzy and distorted. Reducing frequencies above about
5kHz might provide some relief from that, but it isn't high fidelity. As far
as that goes, "warm" isn't a term I would associate with high fidelity
either. Accuracy, perhaps.

Since recording a live event (or generating the illusion of a live event in
the studio) is an art form, high fidelity is a complex concept. IMHO, the
most neutral medium and reproduction equipment would be the best way to
reproduce the original sound. Vinyl, and most analog storage technology is
measurably and objectively nowhere near as neutral as modern digital
technology. Flame on...


Wait until recycled vinyl is used for the records as the companies did in the
1970's "oil crisis"; it wasn't just the sound that was a problem..

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
AZ Nomad wrote:

On Fri, 29 Aug 2008 05:20:01 GMT, Chronic Philharmonic
wrote:


"AZ Nomad" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 28 Aug 2008 08:37:49 +0000 (UTC), Steven Sullivan
wrote:
In rec.audio.tech DarkSide of Nightmix
wrote:
"Those old-fashioned analog platters (with the warm sound)
aren't back from the dead; they were never quite buried in
the first place..."

Business Week: http://atu.ca/6aecf

'warm sound' = euphonic distortion not present on the source tape.


IMNSHO 'warm sound' = muffled high frequencies. It's amazing when
audiophiles
can find cables so incredibly mediocre that they have difficulty handling
frequencies about 5khz and give that lovely warm sound as one would expect
from a worn out record being played with a worn out stylus. Such
progress,
and usually for only $100/ft! But, of course, we all know that equalizers
are bad so it's off to the cable shop to find filters.

A worn out record being played with a worn out stylus never sounded warm to
me. It sounds noisy, fuzzy and distorted. Reducing frequencies above about
5kHz might provide some relief from that, but it isn't high fidelity. As far
as that goes, "warm" isn't a term I would associate with high fidelity
either. Accuracy, perhaps.

Since recording a live event (or generating the illusion of a live event in
the studio) is an art form, high fidelity is a complex concept. IMHO, the
most neutral medium and reproduction equipment would be the best way to
reproduce the original sound. Vinyl, and most analog storage technology is
measurably and objectively nowhere near as neutral as modern digital
technology. Flame on...

No argument here, but I didn't have a $10K phono investment to rationalize
when
CD's first came out. Mine's $10K! It has to sound better than a $300 CD
player! That muffled sound has to be better... Let's give it a name...
warm!

Or another name: "It sounds more like typical acoustic music to ______
(insert name)."

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given that
some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of vinyl,
this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl might have nothing to
do with actual sound quality.

True with CDs too, of course.

[Arny Krueger]

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger
wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given
that some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of
vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl
might have nothing to do with actual sound quality.

True with CDs too, of course.

Of course, but why would one feel compelled to make such an off-topic
comment?

There does seem to be a general preference for sound with less audible noise
and distortion, which is one reason why CD's outsell LPs by more than 100:
1.

[Arny Krueger]

"Jenn" wrote in message


Or another name: "It sounds more like typical acoustic
music to ______ (insert name)."

Mostly said by people who actually have no idea at all what the origional
acoustic performance sounded like because they weren't there.

[George M. Middius[_4_]]

In its haste to escape being lashed by Mistress Jenn's awful Whip Of
Righteousness, the Krooborg snots all over itself.

that some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of
vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl
might have nothing to do with actual sound quality.

True with CDs too, of course.

Of course, but why would one feel compelled to make such an off-topic
comment?

I agree with Mr. ****. The real topic here is Turdy's ongoing battle with
his mental diseases.

Only a truly insane individual could possibly fail to perceive the true
meaning of the Krooborg's coded snot. All the Normals -- including
Mistress Jenn -- understand that the Beast is up to its regular trolling
tricks. Its pet slogan "preference for vinyl might have nothing to do with
actual sound quality" is simply one of its tried-and-true ways of steering
the "debate" to aBxism.

Anybody here want to "debate" Mr. ****'s crack-brained religion? No, I
didn't think so. Shove off -- and shove it too, Arnii.

[Clyde Slick]

On Aug 29, 2:24*pm, "Arny Krueger" wrote:
"Jenn" wrote in message







In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger
wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip

Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? * Given
that some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of
vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?
Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl
might have nothing to do with actual sound quality.
True with CDs too, of course.

Of course, but why would one feel compelled to make *such an off-topic
comment?

There does seem to be a general preference for sound with less audible noise
and distortion, which is one reason why CD's outsell LPs by more than 100:
1.-


cd's are more convenient, that's all

[Arny Krueger]

"Clyde Slick" wrote in message

On Aug 29, 2:24 pm, "Arny Krueger"
wrote:

There does seem to be a general preference for sound
with less audible noise and distortion, which is one
reason why CD's outsell LPs by more than 100:
1.-

cd's are more convenient, that's all

Agreed that dramatically lowered noise and distortion, and a medium that
does not put artificial limits on dynamic range are genuine conveniences.

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message


Or another name: "It sounds more like typical acoustic
music to ______ (insert name)."

Mostly said by people who actually have no idea at all what the origional
acoustic performance sounded like because they weren't there.

As I wrote, "typical acoustic music". There are way that acoustic music
NEVER sounds, and there are plenty of recordings that sound that way.
We've been through this before.

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger
wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip


Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given
that some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of
vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl
might have nothing to do with actual sound quality.

True with CDs too, of course.

Of course, but why would one feel compelled to make such an off-topic
comment?

Just being clear.


There does seem to be a general preference for sound with less audible noise
and distortion, which is one reason why CD's outsell LPs by more than 100:
1.

Fewer and fewer know what acoustic music typically sounds like. Some of
those people like the sound of many CDs. I agree with them. Some of
them also have experienced some LPs to be the best sound at home they
have yet experienced. I'm also one of those people.

[Arny Krueger]

"Jenn" wrote in message


Fewer and fewer know what acoustic music typically sounds like.

So Jenn, you think that all acoustic music sounds the same, or is there any
variation from performance to performance?

IOW, is the concept of "What acoustic music typically sounds like" really a
valid concept?

I guess my ears are still good enough so that I hear variations among what
acoustic music sounds like. Therefore it can't possibly be a fixed reference
for me.

[Arny Krueger]

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message


Or another name: "It sounds more like typical acoustic
music to ______ (insert name)."

Mostly said by people who actually have no idea at all
what the original acoustic performance sounded like
because they weren't there.

As I wrote, "typical acoustic music".

Oh, so Jenn you think that all acoustic music sounds the same?


There are ways that acoustic music NEVER sounds,

Exactly, acoustic music never has rumble, tics, pops, inner groove
distortion, rolled off highs and lows, etc. Yet I have yet to hear an LP
that fails to have one or more of those failings. I've visited the homes of
audiophiles with tens of thousands in audio gear, but yet when they play
vinyl, one or more of those failings is audible. I've been to what are
alleged to be some of the best high end audio shows around, and even in
carefully-setup listening rooms, the vinyl always has one or more of those
problems.

and there are plenty of recordings that sound that way.

Right, and among the "recordings that sound that way", I can count on vinyl
to stick its hand right up and say "I've got clearly audible flaws".

We've been through this before.

Right Jenn, and the only logical conclusion is that there's something going
on with you that keeps you from hearing the well-known audible flaws of
vinyl.

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message


Fewer and fewer know what acoustic music typically sounds like.

So Jenn, you think that all acoustic music sounds the same,

Of course not, and you know that I didn't say that.

or is there any
variation from performance to performance?

Of course.


IOW, is the concept of "What acoustic music typically sounds like" really a
valid concept?

I guess my ears are still good enough so that I hear variations among what
acoustic music sounds like. Therefore it can't possibly be a fixed reference
for me.

As I already wrote and have written to you several times before, there
are ways that acoustic music in a performance space NEVER sounds.
That's what to be avoided, IMO.

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message


Or another name: "It sounds more like typical acoustic
music to ______ (insert name)."

Mostly said by people who actually have no idea at all
what the original acoustic performance sounded like
because they weren't there.

As I wrote, "typical acoustic music".

Oh, so Jenn you think that all acoustic music sounds the same?

What makes you think that?



There are ways that acoustic music NEVER sounds,

Exactly, acoustic music never has rumble, tics, pops, inner groove
distortion, rolled off highs and lows, etc. Yet I have yet to hear an LP
that fails to have one or more of those failings. I've visited the homes of
audiophiles with tens of thousands in audio gear, but yet when they play
vinyl, one or more of those failings is audible. I've been to what are
alleged to be some of the best high end audio shows around, and even in
carefully-setup listening rooms, the vinyl always has one or more of those
problems.

and there are plenty of recordings that sound that way.

Right, and among the "recordings that sound that way", I can count on vinyl
to stick its hand right up and say "I've got clearly audible flaws".

We've been through this before.

Right Jenn, and the only logical conclusion is that there's something going
on with you that keeps you from hearing the well-known audible flaws of
vinyl.

Wrong Arny. As I've said many times before, it's a matter of "picking
your poison". It's ALL artificial. I can listen through a few tics. I
can't listen through a recorded violin sound that resembles an
instrument made of plastic.

[vlad]

On Aug 29, 1:41 pm, Jenn wrote:
In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:



"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger
wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip

Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given
that some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of
vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl
might have nothing to do with actual sound quality.

True with CDs too, of course.

Of course, but why would one feel compelled to make such an off-topic
comment?

Just being clear.



There does seem to be a general preference for sound with less audible noise
and distortion, which is one reason why CD's outsell LPs by more than 100:
1.

Fewer and fewer know what acoustic music typically sounds like.

What an elitist statement to make. I guess we ordinary peasants
don't know how music should sound, never mind that many of us love
live performances. We need advise of gurus like JA, Rober Harley, Jenn
Martin, etc. to know the "TRUTH".

BTW, how do you know that it is "fewer and fewer"?

Some of
those people like the sound of many CDs. I agree with them. Some of
them also have experienced some LPs to be the best sound at home they
have yet experienced. I'm also one of those people.

Some people love necrophilia, I am also not one of those people.

vlad

[Jenn[_3_]]

In article
,
vlad wrote:

On Aug 29, 1:41 pm, Jenn wrote:
In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:



"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
"Arny Krueger" wrote:

"Jenn" wrote in message

In article ,
Andrew Barss wrote:

In rec.audio.tech Arny Krueger
wrote:

Pretty easy to simulate, if you are handy with an
equalizer.

How to increase "warmth":

snip

Has anyone ever manufactured a device to do this
automatically, i.e. a "vivyl warmth"-ifier? Given
that some people (claim to) really enjoy the sound of
vinyl, this would seem to have a built-in market.

Why do you say, "claim to"?

Simple, because an individual's preference for vinyl
might have nothing to do with actual sound quality.

True with CDs too, of course.

Of course, but why would one feel compelled to make such an off-topic
comment?

Just being clear.



There does seem to be a general preference for sound with less audible
noise
and distortion, which is one reason why CD's outsell LPs by more than
100:
1.

Fewer and fewer know what acoustic music typically sounds like.

What an elitist statement to make.

Not at all.

I guess we ordinary peasants
don't know how music should sound, never mind that many of us love
live performances. We need advise of gurus like JA, Rober Harley, Jenn
Martin, etc. to know the "TRUTH".

Another idiotic statement. The evidence is clear: fewer people attend,
play, or sing acoustic music than in the past.


BTW, how do you know that it is "fewer and fewer"?

Concert attendance, instrument purchases, participation in community and
church choirs... all down compared to even 5 years ago.


Some of
those people like the sound of many CDs. I agree with them. Some of
them also have experienced some LPs to be the best sound at home they
have yet experienced. I'm also one of those people.

Some people love necrophilia, I am also not one of those people.

I'm happy that you feel that way, Vlad. I'm especially happy for dead
people everywhere.